이란 공습에 참가한 F-16I Sufa 항법사의 인터뷰

[위종민]

이스라엘 공군에서는 후방석 조종사를 WSO나 RIO가 아니라 항법사라고 부르네요. 

인터뷰이인 I 중령은 이스라엘 공군 최초의 드루즈족 전투기 조종사라고 하네요. 2003년 비행학교를 졸업했고, 졸업성적은 35명 중 22등, 항법사 중에선 2등이었다고 합니다. 조부는 1948년엔 이스라엘과 맞서 싸웠고, 시리아군에 입대해 이스라엘과 또 싸웠다가, 결국엔 IDF에서도 복무해 시리아와 이스라엘군에서 복무해 본 유일한 인물이었다고 합니다. 

시리아 정부군이 베두인을 조종해 드루즈족을 공격한 뒤, 나중에 베두인을 물리치는 척 하며 시리아를 단일 정체로 통합하길 원한다고 생각하네요. 또 이전 집권세력인 알라위파들이 쓸린 게 시리아 내부 드루즈족들에게 경고가 된 모양입니다. 그런데 알라위파 쓸린 건 아사드 집권기때 한 짓이 있어서 그렇고, 드루즈족은 아사드 시절에도 박해받지 않았던가.. 하여튼 이전 글에서 ssn688 선생님께서 말씀하신대로, 시리아와 이스라엘 국경에 완충지대를 설정하고 이스라엘의 지원을 받는 드루즈족들이 거주해야 한다고 말하네요. 

지상공격시엔 항법사가 표적 선정, 락온, 공격방식 결정 등의 주된 결정을 내리고, 공중전에선 항법사가 방어와 무장 운용을 맡는다고 합니다. 이란 공습에선 F-35I가 정보를 제공하고 F-16I가 타격을 실시했다고 하고요. 두 번 출격했고, 재머가 크게 필요없을 정도로 방공망의 저항은 전혀 없었고, ALBM은 이 매우 중요하고, 이스라엘도 GBU-57이 필요하다고 말합니다. 

이스라엘 공군 최초의 드루즈계 F-16I 내비게이터 이 장교는 이스라엘 공군 전술 전투기 승무원이 된 과정과 자신의 민족과 시리아 신정권 사이의 위기에 대해 이야기한다.

2025년 7월 23일

이스라엘 공군 최초의 드루즈계 조종사가 장벽을 허무는 경험에 대해 털어놓았다.

월요일, 워존은 이스라엘 공군(IAF)에서 드루즈계 최초의 조종사로 복무한 인물과 80분간의 단독 인터뷰를 진행했다. 이 대화는 시리아 남부 도시 수웨이다 주변에서 드루즈와 베두인 사이의 휴전이 마무리되는 가운데 이뤄졌다. 이 지역에서의 전투에는 시리아 정권군과 이스라엘군(IDF)까지 개입했으며, IDF는 이스라엘의 드루즈 동맹을 지원한다는 명목으로 다마스쿠스를 폭격하기도 했다.

드루즈는 시리아, 레바논, 이스라엘에 약 100만 명 정도가 거주하는 아랍계 종파로, 소수이지만 영향력이 큰 집단이다. 공동체 내에는 시리아와 이스라엘 모두에 다양한 충성심을 가진 사람들이 있다. 시리아 남부 수웨이다 주에서는 다수를 차지하지만, 지난 10년 동안 드루즈는 바샤르 알아사드 독재 정권에 충성하는 세력과 맞서 싸우는 세력 사이에서 계속 폭력 사태에 휘말려 왔다. 그는 지난해 12월, 12일간의 쿠데타 끝에 실각했다.

2025년 7월 15일, 시리아 정부군이 베두인 부족과 드루즈 전사 간 충돌이 발생한 후 다수 드루즈가 거주하는 수웨이다 시에 진입했다. 시리아 내무부는 이 작전이 베두인 부족과의 충돌로 거의 100명이 사망한 상황을 끝내기 위한 것이라고 밝혔다.

이스라엘 보안 규정에 따라 "I 중령"이라 불리는 이 전술기 승무원은 F-16I 수파의 내비게이터(미 공군 용어로는 무장체계장교)다. 그는 이란 공격 임무를 수행했던 경험, 이란의 미사일 공격 중 공군기지에서 대피했던 기억, 드루즈계 최초 공군 승무원으로서의 생각을 이야기했다. 또한 F-16I에서 비행하고 싸우는 것, 다른 이스라엘 공군기의 특징, 가자지구에 대한 이스라엘의 논란이 많은 공습을 옹호하는 입장도 밝혔다.

이 내비게이터는 유명한 군인 가문 출신이다. 그의 조부는 1948년 이스라엘 독립전쟁 당시 이스라엘과 싸운 드루즈 전사였고, 이후 시리아군에 입대했다가 결국 이스라엘 방위군(IDF)에서도 복무했다. 두 군대 모두에서 복무한 유일한 인물이다.

I 중령이 들려준 내용이 매우 흥미로워, 인터뷰를 두 부분으로 나눠서 싣기로 했다. 오늘은 이스라엘 공군에서 드루즈 최초로 비행하게 된 경험과 시리아 남부의 현 상황에 관한 이야기다. 내일은 F-16I에서의 임무, 그가 경험한 작전, 이스라엘 공군의 전력, 가자지구 공습에 대한 생각 등을 다룰 예정이다.

질문과 답변은 명확성을 위해 편집됐다.

Q: 유명한 드루즈 전사였던 할아버지와 함께 자란 것은 어땠습니까?

A: 어릴 적 그는 제 영웅이었습니다. 그의 이야기와 영웅담, 우리가 들은 모든 것과 함께 성장했고, 우리 공동체에서 매우 존경받는 인물이었습니다. 저 역시 그의 이름을 계속 이어가고 싶다는 생각을 했습니다.

Q: 드루즈로 자라온 배경, 그리고 왜 이스라엘 공군을 선택했는지 말씀해 주세요.

A: 저는 이스라엘 카멜 고지의 작은 드루즈 마을에서 자랐습니다. 청소년 시절은 하이파의 학교에서 보냈고, 마을에서는 배우지 않았습니다. 하이파에서 공부했지만, 마을 친구들과의 관계를 유지하기 위해 축구도 하고 지도자로 활동했습니다. 그 뒤 군에 입대했는데, 처음부터 비행학교에 가는 것이 꿈이었던 것은 아니었습니다. 하지만 모든 시험을 통과해 곧장 비행학교에 들어갔고, 이스라엘 역사상 비행학교를 끝까지 마친 드루즈는 저 이전엔 한 명도 없었습니다. 저보다 먼저 시작했던 드루즈 두 명도 끝까지 완주하지 못했기 때문입니다. 저는 2001년에 비행학교에 들어갔습니다.

2년 후에는 내비게이터(미국식으로는 무장체계장교)로 졸업했고, 라맛 다비드 공군기지의 합동 비행대대에 배속됐습니다.

그 이후 맡은 모든 임무는 공군에서 수행했습니다. 대부분은 작전직이었고, 공군 공격대대장 등 여러 직책을 맡았습니다. 마지막 임무는 남부사령부에서 맡았는데, 공식적으로는 공군 소속이 아니라 남부사령부 소속이었지만, 공군 조종사로서 지상군과 공군의 임무를 조율하는 역할을 했습니다. 최근 2년 반 동안 대부분은 가자지구에서의 공군 임무를 조율하는 일이었습니다.

Q: 이스라엘 공군 최초의 드루즈 조종사가 된 것은 어땠습니까?

A: 처음엔 35명 중 한 명으로서 비행학교를 마쳤기 때문에 특별하다는 느낌을 받지 못했습니다. 저 자신이 다르다고 생각하지 않았고, 그냥 동료 중 한 명이라고 여겼습니다. 하지만 마을에 갈 때마다, 친구나 가족과 이야기할 때마다 모두가 제가 특별한 일을 하고 있다고 느꼈고, 저 역시 그 점을 체감했습니다. 비행학교를 마친다는 것은 이스라엘에서 전반적으로 매우 큰 일이고, 특히 드루즈로서 처음으로 완주한 것이기 때문에 더욱 그랬습니다.

Q: 언제 졸업하셨습니까?

A: 2003년입니다. 22년 전이죠.

Q: 이스라엘 사회와 군에서 드루즈는 어떻게 대우받습니까?

A: 다른 군인이나 장교들과 마찬가지로 동등하다고 느낍니다. 우리는 자원입대가 아니라 의무복무입니다. 드루즈도 유대인들과 똑같이 군에 입대합니다. 군의 모든 부서, 모든 분야가 드루즈 병사에게도 열려 있습니다. 이 변화는 2000년 무렵부터 시작됐고, 이제는 군에서 매우 높은 계급까지 올라간 드루즈도 많이 볼 수 있습니다. 모든 분야, 모든 임무, 심지어 매우 기밀성이 높은 임무도 맡을 수 있습니다. 제 경험을 말하자면, 한 번도 저 자신이 다르거나 차별받는다고 느낀 적이 없습니다. 오로지 능력으로 평가받았을 뿐입니다.

Q: 2000년에 드루즈의 군 복무와 관련해 무엇이 바뀌었습니까?

A: 국가가 변화를 결정해 드루즈가 군의 모든 분야에 진출할 수 있도록 승인한 것이라고 생각합니다.

Q: 드루즈 내부의 정치, 사회, 관계는 매우 복잡한데, 이에 대해 설명해 주실 수 있습니까?

A: 시리아 상황은 매우 복잡합니다. 지금은 휴전에 대해 듣고 있지만, 오래 유지될 수 있는 해법은 아닙니다. 그래서 드루즈가 거주할 수 있는 환경을 만들 해법을 생각해야 합니다. 저는 이스라엘이 북쪽 국경에 완충지대를 만들 전략적 필요성을 생각해야 한다고 봅니다. 안보 측면에서 이론적으로 지하디스트들이 국경 북쪽에 남아 있도록 두어서는 안 된다고 생각합니다.

이스라엘은 완충지대를 만들고 드루즈가 그곳에 머물 수 있도록 이스라엘이 방어해야 합니다. 그래야만 가자지구에서 있었던 10월 7일 같은 일이 다시 일어나지 않을 수 있습니다. 지금 상황을 그대로 두면, 앞으로 몇 주, 몇 달 안에 또다시 베두인 부족이 일어나 이데올로기 때문에 드루즈를 공격할 수 있습니다. 시리아의 드루즈 전사들은 신념과 용기, 싸울 수 있다는 의지가 높습니다. 하지만 공정하게 싸우기 위한 장비가 부족합니다. 그래서 이스라엘의 지원이 필요하다고 생각합니다. 이스라엘이 직접 전투에 참여해 드루즈 마을을 방어해 줘야 합니다.

Q: 그 마을에 있는 사람들로부터 어떤 이야기를 듣고 있습니까? 시리아 정부를 지지하는 드루즈도 있고, 이스라엘이 보호해주기를 바라는 이들도 있다고 들었습니다.

A: 네, 두 가지 입장이 다 존재하지만, 시리아의 대부분 드루즈는 새로운 시리아 정권이 무기를 내려놓은 알라위파에게 무슨 일을 했는지 봤습니다. 그런 일이 드루즈 마을에도 일어나지 않는다는 보장이 없습니다. 무기를 내려놓고 평화가 올 것이라고 믿을 수 없습니다. 지하디스트, 즉 ISIS의 이념은 나라 전체를 이슬람 율법에 기반한 국가로 만드는 것입니다. 그래서 수웨이다의 드루즈들은 현명하게 대처했습니다. 과거의 일을 보고 무기를 내려놓지 않고, 시리아 대통령(아흐메드 알샤라)과 합의해 수웨이다에 정부군이 진입하지 않는 조건으로 자치권을 유지하기로 했습니다. 하지만 저는 새로운 정권의 목표가 결국 모든 시리아 지역, 부족, 종파를 하나의 깃발 아래 통합하는 것이라고 생각합니다. 그들은 베두인 부족을 이용해 드루즈를 공격하게 하고, 그 후 마치 기사처럼 나타나 드루즈를 돕는 척 하려 합니다.

Q: 피해를 본 사람들을 많이 알고 계십니까? 드루즈에 대한 심각한 종파 폭력이 있었다는 보도도 있습니다.

A: 영상도 보고 있고, 마을 안의 사람들과 계속 연락을 취합니다. 저 자신이 직접은 아니지만, 가족이 그곳에 있습니다. 아버지의 사촌들이 아직 시리아 수웨이다와 인근 마을에 살고 있습니다. 그들의 소식을 듣고, 우리 비행기와 드론을 통해서도 상황이 매우 복잡하다는 것을 확인합니다. 마을이 포위되어 있고, 드루즈 마을로 계속 군대가 몰려들고 있습니다. 인도주의적 상황은 매우 열악합니다. 하지만 드루즈 공동체는 어디에 살든, 시리아, 레바논, 이스라엘에 있든 깊은 연대감과 상호 책임감을 가지고 있습니다. 국경을 넘어 역사와 신앙, 운명을 공유합니다. 그래서 시리아에서 무슨 일이 일어나든 저 역시 고통스럽고, 그냥 지켜보고 있을 수만은 없습니다.

내일은 I 중령이 이스라엘 공군에서 겪은 경험에 대해 이야기할 예정입니다.


이스라엘 F-16I 항법사가 밝히는 이란 공습의 현장

하마스와의 전쟁이 3년에 접어든 지금, 이스라엘 공군(IAF)은 역사상 가장 치열한 작전 템포를 경험하고 있다. 이스라엘 공군은 가자 지구에 수만 톤의 폭탄을 투하했을 뿐만 아니라, 레바논, 시리아, 예멘의 표적도 공격했다. 여기에 더해, 수십 년간 준비해온 이란을 상대로 한 고위험 공중전도 수행했다. 이러한 작전은 이스라엘 공군의 장거리 도달 능력과 전술적 역량을 입증했지만, 많은 사상자를 유발해 국제적 비난을 받기도 했다. 이스라엘 공군 전술기 전력의 주축은 F-16I ‘수파’(Storm, 히브리어로 ‘폭풍’)다. 이번에 해당 기종의 베테랑 승무원을 직접 인터뷰하여 F-16I 조종과 전투에 대한 경험을 들을 수 있었다.

이스라엘 공군의 한 항법사(익명, ‘중령 I’로 표기)는 이스라엘의 작전, 역량, 자신이 이란, 가자, 레바논에서 임무를 수행한 경험에 대해 솔직하게 밝혔다.

Q: 이스라엘 공군은 조종사 후보 선발이 매우 엄격한 것으로 알려져 있습니다. 어떤 과정이었나요?

A: 비행학교는 각 과정마다 약 1만 명이 지원합니다. 하지만 실제 졸업자는 제트기 조종사, 항법사, 헬리콥터 조종사 등 모두 합쳐 35명 정도로 매우 적습니다. 실제 비행과 복잡한 임무를 수행하는 시험, 그리고 성격 검사, 도보 내비게이션 등 다양한 시험을 치릅니다. 모든 점수를 종합해 순위를 매깁니다.

Q: 본인의 순위는 어땠나요?

A: 전체에서는 22등이었고, 항법사 과정에서는 2등이었습니다.

Q: F-16I 승무원 선발은 어땠나요?

A: 졸업 후 각 전투비행대대로 배치됩니다. 최상위 조종사가 한 곳에 몰리지 않도록 NBA 드래프트처럼 분산 배치합니다.

Q: 다른 기종 경험이 있나요?

A: 전부 F-16 계열만 몰았습니다.

Q: F-16I만의 장점과 다른 기종과의 차별점은?

A: F-16I는 추가 연료탱크를 탑재해 더 멀리 갈 수 있습니다. 첨단 정보수집 장비가 있어 현장 상황을 파악할 수 있으며, 다양한 미사일과 폭탄을 탑재해 신속한 공격이 가능합니다. 특히 기체가 작고 기동성이 뛰어납니다.

Q: F-16I와 F-16C/D의 차이는 무엇인가요?

A: 외형상으로는 거의 같지만, F-16I는 추가 연료탱크로 항속거리가 더 깁니다. 내부에는 장거리 미사일, 첨단 무기 등을 더 많이 탑재할 수 있습니다.

Q: 편대 내 정보 공유는 어떻게 하나요?

A: 네트워크로 서로 소통하며, 4대 편대 등 편대 내 다른 기체의 상황을 무전 없이 지도상에서 모두 볼 수 있습니다. 누가 어떤 표적에 락온했는지 확인하고 효율적으로 목표를 분배합니다. 착륙 후에는 모든 비행영상을 복기하며 실수 없이 전문성과 우수성을 높입니다.

Q: 2인승 F-16에서 항법사의 역할은?

A: 이스라엘에서는 ‘무장조작사’가 아니라 ‘항법사’라고 부릅니다. 임무 유형에 따라 다르지만, 공격 임무에서는 항법사가 표적 선정, 락온, 공격 방식 결정 등 핵심 결정을 내립니다. 공중전 등에서는 조종사가 지휘관이 되고, 항법사는 방어, 무장 운용을 맡습니다.

Q: F-16I와 F-35, F-15I 등의 협동은 어떻게 이뤄지나요?

A: 이란과의 전쟁에서는 모든 기체가 협력했습니다. F-35는 주로 첩보 임무를 맡아 다양한 정보를 제공하며, F-16I는 이 정보를 바탕으로 보다 정밀한 공격을 수행합니다. 각 기종별 역할 분담이 분명합니다.

Q: F-16I가 F-35에 비해 우위에 있는 점은?

A: F-35는 스텔스 유지를 위해 내부 무장창에만 폭탄을 실을 수 있지만, F-16I는 날개에 외부 무장을 더 실을 수 있어 폭탄 투하량이 많다는 장점이 있습니다.

Q: 연료탱크가 비행성능에 미치는 영향은?

A: 탱크가 없으면 멀리 갈 수 없지만, 탱크가 있으면 조종이 좀 더 어렵고 비행 성능이 떨어집니다. 그래도 장거리 비행이 중요해 탱크를 선호합니다.

Q: 첫 전투 임무는?

A: 2006년 2차 레바논전에서 미사일 표적이 된 건물 공격이었습니다. 임무 중 표적이 바뀌는 등 압박감이 컸습니다. 안전을 위해 고고도로 비행했고, 표적은 카메라로만 확인했습니다.

Q: 어떤 탄약을 사용했나요?

A: GBU-38, GBU-31 JDAM(합동직격탄)을 사용했습니다.

Q: 이란 ‘라이징 라이온 작전’에도 참여했나요?

A: 네, 이란 공습에 직접 참여했습니다. 첫 임무 후 매우 성공적이라 놀랐습니다. 어려운 임무였지만 수년간의 훈련, 철저한 표준, 문화를 바탕으로 높은 수준의 성과를 냈습니다.

Q: 이란 작전에서 몇 번 비행했나요?

A: 2번, 약 일주일 간격이었습니다.

Q: 첫 파도(웨이브)에 참여했나요?

A: 네.

Q: 이란 영공을 넘으며 느낀 점은?

A: 미지의 세계로 간다는 느낌이었습니다. 모든 훈련과 준비를 했지만 실제로는 어떤 상황이 기다릴지 몰랐습니다. 표적에 도달해 공격을 성공적으로 마치고 돌아올 때, 역사적인 임무를 해냈다는 성취감이 들었습니다.

Q: 방공망의 저항은 있었나요?

A: 전혀 없었습니다. 드론에는 미사일을 쐈지만, 제트기에는 한 발도 발사하지 않았습니다.

Q: 이란의 반응에 놀랐나요?

A: 임무는 성공할 것이라 확신했지만, 이란 측의 미온적 반응에는 놀랐습니다. 이스라엘 공군의 우수성과 기술, 무장에 대한 자신감이 더 높아졌습니다.

Q: 2024년 이란의 탄도미사일 보복 때 군기지에 있었나요?

A: 일부 기지가 타격을 받았으나 통합방공망이 효과적으로 대응해 피해가 적었습니다. 당시 저는 헤르츨리야 근처 남부 기지에 있었습니다. 미사일 경보는 익숙해 무서움보다는 일상적이었습니다. 이란은 훨씬 더 큰 피해를 기대했겠지만, 실제 피해는 미미했습니다.

Q: Delilah, Rampage 같은 원격유도무기의 운용 경험은?

A: 자세한 내용은 말할 수 없습니다.

Q: 공군에서 원거리 공대지 탄도미사일이 중요해졌나요?

A: 매우 중요합니다. 장거리 표적 타격으로 전략적·전술적 유연성이 커집니다. 드론 위협 등에도 우위 유지에 필수적입니다.

Q: 이 무기들이 이란 공격에도 쓰였나요?

A: 네.

Q: 향후 이란 상공 비행을 예상하나요?

A: 당장은 없을 것 같습니다. 하지만 중동에서는 아무도 확신할 수 없습니다.

Q: F-16I에 추가되었으면 하는 무기는?

A: 만약 있다면 ‘모든 폭탄의 어머니(MOAB)’, 즉 GBU-57 대형 관통폭탄이 필요합니다. 그러나 IAF 보유 기체 중 투하 가능한 기종이 없어 새로운 해결책이 필요하다고 생각합니다.

Q: F-16I의 전자전, 조기경보 등 지원기 운용은?

A: 자체 방해(jamming) 능력이 있지만, 이번 임무에서는 방공 미사일 위협이 없어서 크게 필요하지 않았습니다.

Q: 임무에서 가장 큰 걱정은?

A: 생존이 아니라 임무 완수 자체에 집중합니다. 자신과 동료의 임무 달성, 그리고 보호에 집중합니다.

Q: 고강도 작전이 이어지는 상황에서 기체와 전력 유지 비결은?

A: 최고의 정비병 덕분입니다. 24시간 365일 신속히 문제를 해결하며, 오래된 F-15 Baz도 50년간 무사히 운용되고 있습니다. F-16I도 22년째지만 새 기체처럼 유지됩니다. 이란 작전에서도 엔진 한 개로 장거리 왕복이 가능했습니다.

Q: 가자 지구 공격으로 많은 민간인 사망자가 발생해 국제적 비난이 큽니다. 이에 대한 생각은?

A: 전쟁은 정당하다고 믿습니다. 민간인 피해를 최소화하기 위해 최대한 노력하며, 민간인에게 공격 전 대피 메시지를 보내기도 합니다. 이는 임무에 악영향을 줄 수도 있지만, 시민을 보호하려 노력합니다. 하지만 테러리스트들이 시민을 인간방패로 사용해 민간인 피해가 불가피합니다.

Q: 학교, 종교시설 등 민간인 시설도 공격 대상으로 삼는다는 비판에 대해서는?

A: 의도적으로 공격하지 않습니다. 테러리스트들이 그런 곳을 은신처로 삼기 때문에 불가피하게 공격 대상이 되는 경우가 있습니다.

Q: 이스라엘의 민간인 피해에 대한 국제적 비판에 대한 생각은?

A: 위선적이라고 생각합니다. 다른 전쟁 지역에서는 이스라엘이 하는 것의 10%도 하지 않으면서 비판만 한다고 봅니다.

Q: 가자 지구 임무에 참여한 경험이 있나요?

A: 네, 지난 2년간 100~150회 출격했습니다. 인질, 민간인, 자국 군이 혼재한 복잡한 환경에서 매우 신중하고 정밀하게 임무를 수행합니다.

Q: 주로 어떤 무기를 사용하나요?

A: GBU-38, GBU-31 JDAM을 사용합니다.

Q: 남부 전선에서 지상군과 공군의 협조 방식은?

A: 지상군이 직접 표적을 식별해 좌표와 첩보를 제공하면 공군이 정밀 공격합니다. 협조에는 양측 운용을 이해하는 중개자가 필수적입니다.

Q: 시리아(다마스쿠스, 수웨이다 등) 공습에는 참여했나요?

A: 아쉽게도 기회가 없었습니다. 참여 기회가 있다면, 공동체를 보호하고 싶습니다.

Q: 비행 중 위험했던 경험이 있다면?

A: 훈련 중 타 기체와 거의 충돌할 뻔한 적이 있습니다.

Q: IAF가 F-15EX 기반 최신 F-15 도입을 추진 중인데, 더 많은 F-16도 필요하다고 보나요?

A: F-16은 충분합니다. F-15는 더 많은 폭탄, 무장 탑재가 가능해 전략적으로 필요합니다. F-35는 기술적으로 세계 최고이므로, 앞으로 더 많은 도입이 필요합니다.

Q: 추가로 하고 싶은 말이 있다면?

A: 이스라엘 국방군은 7개 전선을 맞서 싸우며, 기술, 인력, 장비, 협업 모두 세계 최고 수준임을 입증했습니다. 앞으로 이 지역에 평화가 오길 바라며, 이스라엘이 시리아 북부 드루즈 등 지역 평화 정착에 기여하길 바랍니다. 이란에 대한 공격 등으로 중동이 새롭게 변화하고 있으니, 미래 세대를 위해 더 밝은 미래를 만들어가야 합니다.

This F-16I Navigator Is The First Druze Aviator In Israeli Air Force History

This F-16I Navigator Is The First Druze Aviator In Israeli Air Force History

The officer talks about becoming an IAF tactical fighter crewman and reflects on the crisis between his people and the new regime in Syria.

Howard Altman

Jul 23, 2025 7:29 PM EDT

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A file photo of an IAF aviator walking to an F-16I.  

(Photo by JACK GUEZ / AFP) (Photo by JACK GUEZ/AFP via Getty Images)

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On Monday, The War Zone conducted an 80-minute-long exclusive interview with the first member of the Druze community to serve as an aviator in the Israeli Air Force (IAF). The conversation took place as a ceasefire was being finalized between Druze and Bedouins in and around the southern Syrian city of Suweida. Fighting there drew in Syrian regime forces as well as the IDF, which wound up bombing Damascus supposedly in support of Israel’s Druze allies.

The Druze are an Arab sect of about one million people living in Syria, Lebanon and Israel, where they make up a small but influential minority. The community has varying loyalties to both Syria and Israel. While they are a majority in Syria’s southern Suweida province, over the last decade, the Druze have been caught up in the violence between forces loyal to and fighting against dictator Bashar al-Assad. He was deposed last December in a stunning 12-day coup.

Syria’s security forces enter the predominantly Druze city of Suweida on July 15, 2025, following clashes between Bedouin tribes and Druze fighters that have killed nearly 100 people. (Photo by Sam HARIRI / AFP) SAM HARIRI

The tactical jet crewman, whom we have to refer to as “Lt. Col. I.” under Israeli security practices, is an F-16I Sufa navigator (weapon systems officer in U.S. parlance). Lt. Col. I. talked about flying attack missions on Iran, taking shelter at an airbase during an Iranian missile barrage and his thoughts about being the first Druze aircrew member. He also discussed what it’s like flying and fighting in the F-16I, the attributes of other IAF aircraft, and defended Israel’s controversial airstrikes on Gaza.

The navigator comes from a famous military family. His grandfather was a Druze warrior who fought against Israel during its War of Independence in 1948, later joined the Syrian Army and ultimately became a member of the Israel Defense Forces (IDF), the only man to serve in both armies.

Because Lt. Col. I. offered so many fascinating details, we decided to break our interview up into two pieces. Today’s piece is about what it is like being the first Druze to fly with the IAF and the current situation in southern Syria. Tomorrow’s installment will be about his role flying in the F-16I with the IAF, the missions he’s been on, the IAF’s inventory, his thoughts about Gaza attacks and much more.

The questions and answers have been edited for clarity.

Elders of the Druze community gather during a meeting in the Druze village of Majdal Shams in the Israeli-annexed Golan Heights on July 16, 2025. (Photo by Jalaa MAREY / AFP) JALAA MAREY

Q: What was it like to grow up with such a famous Druze warrior like your grandfather?

A:  So he was my hero when I was young, and I was able to grow up on his stories and his heroism and all the things that we heard about him, and he was very respected in our community. And I hope that I continue his name as well.

Q: Tell me some more about your background, growing up as a Druze. And why join the IAF?

A: So I grew up a small Druze village in the Carmel Heights [in Israel]. I spent my youth studying in Haifa, at a school there. I didn’t learn in our village. I learned in Haifa, but what I did to maintain contact with my friends in the villages was to play football and be an instructor. Afterwards, I joined the Army. It wasn’t my dream to join the Flight Academy, but I passed all the exams and went directly to the Flight Academy, which was quite unique, because before me, there was not even one Druze who finished the Flight Academy in the history of Israel. But there were two others who started the Flight Academy before me, but they didn’t finish. So in 2001, I started the Flight Academy.

After two years, I finished as a navigator – which is called the weapon system operator in the U.S. Air Force. I was assigned to the joint squadron at Ramat David [Airbase].

An Israeli Air Force F-16I Sufa fighter. (IAF) IAF

And all the duties that I did were in the Air Force. Most of my jobs were in operational roles, like commander of the attack section in the Air Force. And the last role that I did was with Southern Command. It wasn’t under the title of the Air Force. I was under the title of the Southern Command, but as a pilot who is the coordinator between the Air Force and the ground troops. That’s what I did in the last two and a half years. Most of the duty was to coordinate the Air Force tasks and missions in the Gaza Strip…”

Q: What was it like being the first Druze aviator in the IAF?

A: At first, I didn’t feel like I was special because I was one of the 35 that finished the Flight Academy, and I didn’t feel that I was different from them, because I was one of the guys. But each time that I came to the village, and of course, speaking with my friends and my family, everybody feels that it’s special what I’m doing, because I was the first one. And finishing the Flight Academy is a very big thing in Israel, generally, but especially to be the first one to finish as a Druze.

Q: When did you graduate?

A: 2003, 22 years ago.

Q: How are Druze treated in Israeli society and the military?

A: We feel as equal as the other soldiers or officers in the army. We don’t volunteer for the army. It’s mandatory. The Druze people join the army in the same way as the Jewish people. In the army, all the sections, all the forces are open to Druze soldiers. But that started like from 2000 and now you can see Druze who are in very high ranks in the army and all the forces, all the tasks, even in the very, very classified roles. And as a I can say from my story, I didn’t feel for one second that I’m different than the others, or that I was treated differently. I was examined by my skills, and that’s it.

Q: What changed in 2000 with regard to the Druze serving in the Israeli military?

A: I think that the state decided to make the change and approve the Druze to join all the sections in the army. 

Druze soldiers in the IDF. (IDF)

Q: There are many facets to Druze internal politics, society and relations. Can you talk a little bit about that?

A: In Syria, the situation is very complicated. We are hearing about the cease-fire. But it’s not a solution that can be maintained for a long time. That’s why we need to think about a solution that will make the area…more suitable to stay in for the Druze. I think that Israelis should think about the strategic necessity of a buffer zone north of the border. I think from a security standpoint, we shouldn’t allow Israel to let theoretical jihadists stay over the north border. 

Israel should create a buffer zone and keep the Druze there with Israeli defense on it so that we don’t take another 7th of October like we did in Gaza. Because if we leave the situation as we see now, I think that we will see in weeks or months again, Bedouin tribes will decide to get up in the morning and go to kill some Druze, just because of the ideology of ISIS and terrorism. The morale and the spirit of the Druze warriors in Syria, the spirit is high because we believe in faith, we believe in our strength, we believe that we can fight. But unfortunately, we don’t have the equipment necessary to make a fair fight. That’s why we need the Israelis inside, to join the fights and defend the Druze villages.

Syrian Druze fighters celebrate atop a damaged army military vehicle, after Syrian government forces pulled out of the southern Suweida governorate, on July 17, 2025. The Druze heartland Suweida has been gripped by deadly sectarian bloodshed since July 13, with hundreds reportedly killed in clashes pitting Druze fighters against Sunni Bedouin tribes and the army and its allies. (Photo by Shadi AL-DUBAISI / AFP) SHADI AL-DUBAISI

Q: What are you hearing from folks in those villages? I know there are some Druze who support the Syrian government, and some who want to see the Israeli government providing protection. 

A: Yeah, we hear about those two sides of the story, but most of the Druze in Syria see what the Syrian regime, the new regime, did to the Alewites after they dropped their weapons. So if we see that the story that happened with the Alewites, you can’t ignore that and do the same with the Druze villages. You can’t actually drop your weapon and think about, okay, there will be peace and they won’t hurt us. The ideology of the jihadist, the ISIS, is actually to make the whole country based on Sharia, based on the belief of the ideology of Islam. So the Druze…in Suweida, they are smart. They saw what happened, and they decided not to drop their weapons and actually to make an autonomy based on agreement with [Syrian President Ahmed al-Sharaa] that they won’t enter Suweida, and they’ll keep their autonomy there. But I think that the goal of the new regime is actually to take over all the Syrian parts, all the Syrian tribes, all Syrian religion and make it under one flag of the Syrian new regime. So they decided to take the Bedouin tribes and sent them to hurt the Druze, then afterwards, coming like knights and helping the Druze…

Q: And do you know a lot of people who have suffered? There have been reports of horrific sectarian violence committed against the Druze. Do you know people who’ve had problems like that?

A: We see the videos, and we are in touch with the people inside the villages. We talk to them, not me personally, because I’m still in the reserve, but I have family there. My father’s cousins are still living in Syria, in Suweida, and the village is near to it. So we hear from them, and we see, actually, now, with all our planes and all our drones, we see that the situation there is very complicated. There’s a siege on the villages. We see all the troops coming to the Druze villages. And the situation there, humanitarian, is very, very low. It’s very, very hard. But the community of the Druze, wherever we live, even if it’s in Syria, Lebanon or Israel, we share a deep sense of solidarity and mutual emotional responsibility. We go beyond the borders. We have a common history. We have a common faith. We share the same destiny. So whatever happens in Syria hurts us, hurts me. We can’t stand by and not take action.

Tomorrow, Lt. Col. I. talks about his time in the IAF, which you can find here.

Contact the author: howard@thewarzone.com

Howard AltmanSenior Staff Writer

Howard is a Senior Staff Writer for The War Zone, and a former Senior Managing Editor for Military Times. Prior to this, he covered military affairs for the Tampa Bay Times as a Senior Writer. Howard's work has appeared in various publications including Yahoo News, RealClearDefense, and Air Force Times.

Israeli F-16I Navigator Opens Up About Striking Iran

Israeli F-16I Navigator Opens Up About Striking Iran

Israeli F-16I Navigator Opens Up About Striking Iran

An F-16I navigator gives an exclusive look into flying combat missions, long-distance fighter operations, and the ongoing war in Gaza.

Howard Altman

Jul 24, 2025 8:04 PM EDT

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Nearly three years into the war against Hamas, the Israeli Air Force (IAF) finds itself in the midst of one of the fiercest operational tempos in its history. In addition to dropping tens of thousands of tons of bombs on the Gaza Strip, the IAF has also attacked targets in Lebanon, Syria, and Yemen. On top of this, Israel executed a high-risk air war against Iran after decades of planning. These operations have showcased the IAF’s reach and tactical prowess, but some of them have also sparked international condemnation due to the large number of resulting casualties. An aircraft that serves as a backbone of the Israel Air Force’s tactical jet force is the F-16I “Sufa” (Storm in Hebrew). Now, in a rare opportunity, we talked in-depth to one of the type’s most experienced crewmen about what it’s like to fly and fight in the highly customized Israel-specific variant of the F-16.

We spoke with an IAF aviator who offered candid insights about the service’s actions, capabilities and his own experience in the cockpit conducting attacks on Iran, Gaza and Lebanon.

Israel’s first F-16I jet fighter taxis after landing at the Ramon Air Force Base in Israel’s Negev desert. (Photo by David Silverman/Getty Images) David Silverman

The War Zone conducted this exclusive wide-ranging 80-minute interview on Monday with an F-16I navigator we’ll call Lt. Col. I. under Israeli security practices. Lt. Col. I. is also the first Druze aviator in the IAF, which you can read all about in our first installment of the interview here. In this second installment, he extolled the virtues of his aircraft, talked about combat operations over Iran, how the IAF wages long-distance aerial warfare, and much more. We reached out to U.S. officials for comment about Lt. Col. I.’s claims and will update this story with any pertinent information provided.

The navigator also gave his justification for the IAF’s strikes on Gaza.

The following questions and answers were edited for clarity.

Q: The Israeli Air Force is known for being extremely selective when it comes to selecting pilot candidates, and the training is also known to be very challenging. What was the selection for fighters in the training like?

A: Flight Academy started with like 10,000 candidates in each flight course. The number of finishers in each flight course is like 35 people from all the sections of the Flight Academy, like jet pilots, navigators like me, helicopter pilots, everyone. So the percentage of the finishers is very, very low.

The exams start with flying, actually flying in the air, to be able to do complicated missions during the flights, to see how you think, how fast you think and how you can do drills under pressure. Another section of exams we do on the ground. Personality exams, navigating by foot and some other things I can’t talk about it because they’re classified. But there are other ground drills that we do to examine your personality and the way you think. After all this, they combine a number that ranks you among all the people in the course.

Q: What was your number?

A: I finished like number 22, something like that. But it depends on which part of the Flight Academy you are in. So I was 22 in general, but in my section, the navigators. I was number two in my class.

Q: How tough was it to get selected as an F-16I crew member?

A: In the Flight Academy, after the course, you separate into different squadrons. Not all the best pilots go to one squadron. We spread them out to make all the squadrons as good as possible. We don’t put just the best ones in F-35 or the best in F-16I. We don’t do that. It’s like a draft in the NBA.

Q: Have you flown operationally in any other IAF aircraft?

A: I fly just in the F-16I. Before, it was the F-16. So all my duty was on F-16s. So I don’t know anything else than that.

Q: What does the F-16I bring to the table compared to other fighters in the IAF inventory and and are there particular mission sets your community specializes in? And how does it compare to the F-16Cs and Ds in Israeli service?

A: The F-16I is more likely to be the plane that goes as far as possible, because we have extra fuel tanks. It’s an intelligence plane that gives you an intelligence view of what’s going on in the field. And of course, it’s a strike plane that can take each kind of missile and bomb to the target. The uniqueness of the F-16 is that it is able to do it fast. It’s an aerodynamic plane more than the others, and it’s smaller than the others.

An Israeli Air Force F-16I “Sufa” Fighting Falcon takes off with full power afterburner. (IAF)

Q: How does the F-16I compare to the C or D variants?

A: We have different equipment, especially inside the plane. The structure of the plane is almost the same as the C or D, but we have the extra tanks that make the shape of the plane different. So that also makes the range of the plane better than the C or D. But inside the plane, we have different equipment, especially the things that we can take with us, like long-range missiles, weapons or smart bombs. That’s the main difference.

Q: How do the planes and crews work together in a formation?

A: We have a network to communicate with each other, as the planes actually talk to each other. We can see the information in our formation that we fly, like four planes or something like that. We can see the information inside the other planes without even the need to talk to each other. That’s why we can also communicate better than other planes. We can see on the map all the details that the other planes in our formation do, like if they lock on the target. I can see that he locked on a target. So I can take the other target that my wingman didn’t. But the things that make it better than other air forces, in my opinion, are the things that we train all the time. We put excellence, all the professionalism, in a high place in our training. We can’t make mistakes. We debrief everything that we do in the plane. We actually land and see all the videos of the training and also, of course, the mission task, the operational tasks, but we see each and every video after we land which would make us professional and make us excellent.

Q: An F-16 with a weapon systems officer is a fairly rare concept. Israel is one of the handful that use this configuration. How does another crewman squeeze more out of the F-16, and how do you work together?

A: We don’t call it a weapon systems operator; we call it a navigator, which I am. So it’s teamwork and depends on which mission you’re going on. If it’s an attack mission, most of the things or the crucial decisions are made by the navigator. If on an attack, I choose the target, I lock on it, I see in my formation which is the better way to attack the target, and I decide how we do this. If it’s an air-to-air mission against aircraft or other missions that don’t include a ground attack, the pilot is the mission commander. He decided how to go there. The navigator is also responsible for the defense of each aircraft and the formation and for operating the weapons – the missiles and the bombs. 

The Israeli Air Force is one of a handful that operates two-seat F-16 variants that have fully missionized rear cockpits for a two-crew operational doctrine. (JACK GUEZ/AFP via Getty Images)

Q: How does the F-16I work with other fighters, especially the F-15I and the F-15A/B/C/D Baz?. And what about the F-35i stealth fighters?

A:  We saw in the war against Iran the coordination between all the planes. Most of the F-35 missions were intelligence and gave us a lot of information that other planes like the F-16I don’t have. They have a lot of equipment that helps them determine which missiles are heading towards us. And they actually can say to the F-16I, be aware you’re going to meet this kind of missile or another kind. And after we get this information, we do our attack mission that is more precise and more specific. So what we do in our formation is let the F-35 go first, see what’s going on, gather the intelligence and information and give it to us and to the other planes, and then we take this information and attack. Actually, I can’t say specific things because classified, so I’m speaking in general.

Q: And how does the F-16I work with the F-15I and the F-15 Baz?

A: Those aircraft do the same tasks as the F-16I does. It’s almost the same. We don’t actually do separate things. The only thing that we do differently is that the F-16I gathers intelligence, like taking photos of the field that we are going to attack. That’s what we do differently. The other things, like attack or air-to-air missions, are the same. 

Q: What can F-16I do that the F-35 can’t?

A: The difference between the F-16I and the F-35 is that to maintain its ability to be unseen, the F-35 has to carry its bombs inside its belly. We can put the bombs outside on the wings. That’s why the F-16I has a better ability than the F-35 to deliver more bombs.

An Israeli Air Force F-35I Adir (Israeli Air Force)

Q: The conformal tanks are a big part of the F-16I’s abilities. How do they impact the flying quality of the aircraft? And there are other times when you wish you didn’t have them?

A: If we remove them, we won’t be able to get as far as we can now. But yeah, they make the plane harder to fly, and make the plane a little bit complicated, because the aerodynamics aren’t as good as the F-16C or D. But in general, I prefer to take the fuel tanks and fly a little bit grumpy than be without them.

Q: Tell me about your first combat mission.

A: My first combat mission was in Lebanon. It was in 2006 during the second Lebanese war. We got a task, a mission of attacking a building that we understood was where terrorists had missiles aimed towards the northern border. It was at the start of the war, right after the kidnapping of the three Israeli soldiers on the border. And I was very, very thrilled about that, because it was my first mission, you know, attacking over the border. So we had the information before we took off. I remember that they decided to change the coordination to another building, and there was all this pressure about what are we doing? And if the situation there is like a threat with missiles towards planes, we didn’t know whether we were threatened or not. That’s why we flew very high, so we didn’t see the targets; we’d see them just with our cameras.

Q: What kind of munitions did you use in that attack?

A: GBU-38 and GBU-31 Joint Direct Attack Munitions (JDAM).

Q: Did you take part in Operation Rising Lion, designed to dismantle Tehran’s nuclear ambitions and military capability?

A: I can talk a little bit about the Iran mission. I also took part in it. The Iran mission was my best feeling in the Air Force. After we landed from the first mission, we were very pleased with the outcome. We didn’t expect this kind of success. We thought that it would be harder to reach this success. We thought that we would come back from this task while Israel is under attack. But I think that this mission is exactly an example of the Israeli Air Force’s ability to take a mission and, with precision and strategic depth, execute it at a very high level. But that’s not coming from out of nowhere. This level of success is a result of years of intensive training, strict operational standards and culture, and that demands excellence at all times. That’s what we do in training. So we took all of that training we did in the last several years and showed the abilities of the Air  Force. I think that what we did against Iran will be learned in all the universities, all the defense universities all over the world – how to take a mission with good information and intelligence and with the very high professionalism of the troops, you can see the very, very good results. 

Q: How many times did you fly over Iran during Operation Rising Lion, otherwise known as the 12-Day War?

A: Twice, about a week apart.

Q: Which wave in those attacks were you in and what were the targets?

A: I can’t speak about the targets. But you saw the targets that we attacked on the first day. So you can understand what we hit.

Q: Were you part of the first wave of attacks?

A: Yes.

Q: What was it like when you were crossing into Iranian airspace and knowing that you were going to strike targets?

A: The feeling was that we are going to the unknown. We had the information. We did all the drills, we did all the training before, about what the other side had and the risks that we were going to face. But as the first wave, you’re going to the unknown. You don’t know what is going to meet you there. And as we reached the border and crossed it, we saw the early attacks of the other planes, and so we had the feeling that this is the money time. This is the actual time that we did all the training for, now the money time to succeed in the mission. So I was very focused. I didn’t think much about other things. I was focused on the mission and the task, and we did it as perfectly as possible. And just as we headed back west and we saw all the other planes that were coming from Israel, that feeling was unbelievable, a feeling of success and power, that we are doing something historical.

Q: Did you experience any anti-aircraft fire at all?

A: Not at all. They didn’t fire a single anti-aircraft missile towards us in the whole war. They did against drones, but against jet pilots, not even once.

Q: Were you surprised at all at the success of the missions over Iran?

A: I knew for certain that we’re going to succeed in our mission. We were surprised by the response of the Iranian side. We had a belief that we were going to come back from the flight and we will see our base bombed already. But nothing happened. That was the surprise about our ability and about our superiority and the technological field and our missiles and bombs. I was certain that we were going to do the task as good as possible.

Q: Were you at one of the IAF bases that were hit during the 2024 Iranian ballistic missile barrage?

A:  Some bases got hit, but that didn’t cause a lot of damage because of [the integrated air defense system] that we have. It did a very good job against all those missiles. So the damage was very, very small, but I was on the base when one of the attacks happened. It wasn’t so terrifying, because, unfortunately, we are used to hearing sirens all over Israel. So we have the sirens, we go to the protected area, and we hear like a hit of the missile, but it wasn’t as near as we thought. So it wasn’t so terrifying, but I’ll tell you what I think. [The Iranians] thought that they they are going to do much more damage than that, much more damage. 

Q: Where did you ride out that attack?

A: A base in the south near Herzliya.

Q: Walk me through what it’s like to use standoff munitions like the Delilah or Rampage. Why does Israel put such a premium on man-in-the-loop-controlled standoff weapons with optical seekers?

A: I don’t think that I can say all the details about those things, and I don’t know how you know about all those things either (laughs).

Q: How important have air-launched ballistic missiles become for the IAF and for the F-16I?

A: Very important. These weapons make us much more flexible because we can hit targets at long distances. And I think that without those missiles, strategically and tactically, we can’t maintain the superiority against all the drones that come from the east side or the enemy countries. So it’s very important, of course.

The Israeli Air Force (IAF) released a rare picture of an F-16I fighter armed with four Rampage missiles, an adaptation of a ground-launched precision-guided artillery rocket. (IAF)

Q: Did these weapons play a role in the attacks on Iran?

A: Yes.

Q: Can you provide some details?

A: Not so much.

Q: Do you anticipate having to fly over Iran again?

A: In my opinion, I don’t think so, because I don’t think that they’re gonna do anything about the atomic program in the next few years. But as we say in the Middle East, nothing is certain. 

Q: What weapons would you like to see on the F-16I that you don’t have now?

A: I don’t want to speak about F-16I, but if I can take one thing that we don’t have in the Israeli Air Force, it’s the MOAB, the mother of all bombs, maybe the one that they dropped on Fordow.

Q: You mean the GBU-57 Massive Ordnance Penetrator, also called the MOP?

A: Yes, those things we need.

Q: But what aircraft are in the IAF inventory that can drop them? In the USAF, only the B-2 Spirit stealth bomber is certified to do so.

A: That’s a problem. I don’t think that there is. Maybe the F-15I, I but I don’t think it can take this massive bomb. But I think we should think about the solution, such as this bomb, because our bombs are smaller than what we need for this kind of mission. Therefore, we need to think about something new, or something that makes an impact, that now we can’t do.

A U.S. Air Force B-2 Spirit steal bomber dropped a GBU-57 Massive Ordnance Penetrator bomb. (USAF)

Q: What about support aircraft, like electronic surveillance and jamming and airborne early warning and control? How does the F-16I work with those assets to accomplish its mission?

A: In the F-16I, we have the ability to jam radars or missiles headed toward us. We didn’t need to use it so much in this task because, as I said before, there weren’t any ground-to-air missiles that headed towards us. 

Q: Can you talk about support aircraft in the IAF, like electronic surveillance and jamming and airborne early warning aircraft?

A: I don’t think I can talk about it.

Q: What are your biggest concerns when you go on a sortie?

A: This will be a little bit funny, but I’m not thinking about not surviving. I’m thinking about doing the mission. My biggest concern is that I will be able to do the tasks that I’ve sent to do, and the other concern is to be able to do it when I’m protecting myself and my pilot and the other formations. But my biggest concern is to do the mission as good as possible.

Q: The IAF has been operating at an extremely high tempo since the October 7, 2023, attack on Israeli civilians. Fighters have to put in many extra hours over the tumultuous period. Some of them, like the F-15 Baz, are quite old. How is the force able to keep flying so much?

A: That’s because we have very good technical troops working hard each day. 24/7, 365 days a year. They are very professional in what they are doing. They take the planes and improve them. Each malfunction is treated as fast as possible. That’s why we can take the Baz as an example. Like you said, it’s been flying for 50 years already in the Air Force. That’s why, if you say F-16I is a new plane, it’s not so much. It’s like 22 years already in the Air Force. But still, it looks like new. If you take the Iran attacks, it has the ability to fly with one engine all those miles and come back without the need of landing in other countries because of a malfunction or even losing any planes because we don’t have any malfunctions. It’s extraordinary. It’s unbelievable. And that’s why I think the technical troops of the Israeli Air Force are the best in the world.

An Israeli Air Force F-16I Sufa prepares to take off on a mission to strike Iran. (IAF)

Q: Israeli airstrikes have been quite controversial, resulting in a lot of civilian deaths, especially in Gaza. What are your thoughts about that, and what goes through your mind when striking a densely packed area like Gaza?

A: First of all, I believe the war is justified. I know that we do as much as possible to not hurt the civilians in the Gaza Strip. We even do some things that maybe hurt the mission. Instead of hurting the civilians, for example, we actually send messages to civilians to evacuate the building before we attack. That can cause even the evacuation of the terrorists as well, but we don’t want to hurt any civilians during our attacks. Unfortunately, the terrorists use the citizens as a human shield, and instead of protecting them, like the Israeli Air Force and the Israeli Defense Force protecting the civilians of Israel, they use civilians as a human shield and hide behind them. So when we attack terrorists, unfortunately, civilians also get hurt because they’re using them as a human shield.

Q: But these attacks have hit religious institutions and schools and other locations where civilians gather. As a navigator, what do you think about that?

A: We are not doing that on purpose. We’re doing that because they are terrorist activists inside those institutes and inside the mosques, inside the schools, they actually organized whole troops of terrorists. They stay inside the schools, inside the mosques. So if you want to protect our citizens, our troops in the field, we should attack them.

Thousands of displaced Palestinians who had taken shelter in the building evacuated shortly before the Israeli warplanes targeted the Mehran building located in the Al-Nasr neighborhood in central Gaza, following a warning phone call from the Israeli army in Gaza City, Gaza on July 21, 2025. Smoke billowed from the area during the attack and the school was heavily destroyed after the attack. (Photo by Saeed M. M. T. Jaras/Anadolu via Getty Images) Anadolu

Q: Israel has been widely condemned around the world for the number of civilian deaths. What do you think about that?

A: I think it’s hypocritical. Look what they did to us in the Oct. 7 attack – all the monstrous things that they did to us – and what’s going on in Syria, it’s not far from that now. But if we are talking about the Gaza Strip, what they did to us it’s unforgivable, yet we do everything to reduce the number of civilians that get hurt from the other side. 

If you see all the other countries all over the world in a war zone, or in a war right now, they don’t even do like 10% of what we’re doing while they’re attacking the enemy. That’s why it’s hypocritical. If you see the war in Syria or Ukraine, if you see the other wars going around the world, there is no country in earth that does what the Israeli Defense Forces are doing, even if it hurts the mission, and even if it hurts the task that we get.

Q: You’ve flown missions over Gaza, right?

A: Yes.

Q: And what’s that like? What goes through your mind when you are crossing into Gaza?

A: Now, it’s just become ordinary. In the past two years, I did like 100, 150 flights over the Gaza Strip. But we need to be precise, especially in a place like the Gaza Strip, where we have troops. We have civilians that we don’t want to hurt. We have the people who were kidnapped on October 7 also there. We need to be precise, and we have to be professional to do the task is as precisely as possible, not hurting civilians or other things that we don’t want to hurt. So when I go to this mission, I’m very focused, and I’m very precise with what I’m doing.

Q: What munitions do you use on these missions?

A: GBU-38s and GBU-31 [JDAMs], the same as I used over Lebanon.

An Israeli Air Force F-16I takes off with a pair of JDAMs under its wings. AFP PHOTO / JACK GUEZ (Photo credit should read JACK GUEZ/AFP via Getty Images) JACK GUEZ

Q: You had mentioned that you work on integration between the ground forces and the air forces in the southern region. So that’s Gaza and elsewhere. Talk about that a little bit.

A: What we need to do is to see that the information we get in the Air Force is based on specific information and based on information that we get from the ground troops that see the targets – all the terrorists – with their own eyes. And then they can send us the coordinates and send us the intelligence that we need to make a precise attack from the air. We also do this from the air and not with ground troops, because sometimes the targets are very far from the troops. Sometimes we don’t want to put the troops at risk, so we do it by air. And the coordination between the troops, the ground troops and the Air Force should be by someone who understands how the Air Force works, how the planes work, and knows the abilities and the capabilities of the Air Force, and then speaks the language of the ground troops to make all this work in synergy.

Q: Did you take part in any of the strikes on Syria, either in Damascus or the majority-Druze Suweida area that came under attack by Bedouins and regime-aligned forces?

A: Unfortunately, I didn’t get the chance. 

Q: Would you like to?

A: Of course. I want to protect my brothers.

Q: How close have you come to disaster in the sky?

A: Just in practice. We had two aircraft near each other, and it wasn’t coordinated between us. We almost get crushed against each other.

Q: ​​The IAF is buying more F-15s that are based on the F-15EX. What do you think of that decision? And does the IAF need newer F-16s too?

A: I don’t think so. We’re going towards getting F-35 squadrons and F-15s, as you say. We have a lot of F-16s. They do the mission as good as possible, but the F-15 gives us more ability to take more bombs and ammunition to the targets. So that’s why strategic thinking about getting F-15 squadrons. And the F-35 is the best plane technologically now in the world. It proved itself very much in the last war against Iran. So we need more F-35s.

Q: Is there anything I haven’t asked you that you want to talk about?

A: The main idea that I want to say is that the IDF is facing seven different war zones. And because of good people, because of the high technology, because of unique equipment, and because of the coordination of all the forces, our defense missions and attack missions are very high quality. And after two years of war, the Air Force and the IDF proved themselves all over the globe.

I think that it’s the time to get peace in our zone, and I think it starts with the northern border, with the Druze, as Israel can help them and change the situation in Syria. And it continues with Iran in the new Middle East that the Israeli Air Force did with the attack against Iran, and I think that now is the opportunity to get to a deal with all the countries here in the area to have a much brighter future for our kids.

That’s what I think we should do.

Contact the author: howard@thewarzone.com

Howard AltmanSenior Staff Writer

Howard is a Senior Staff Writer for The War Zone, and a former Senior Managing Editor for Military Times. Prior to this, he covered military affairs for the Tampa Bay Times as a Senior Writer. Howard's work has appeared in various publications including Yahoo News, RealClearDefense, and Air Force Times.

[백선호]

Air LORA는 찍은 좌표로 날아가는 seekerless 무장이니 정보력이 진짜 중요하겠습니다.

[위종민]

사실 시리아 아사드 정권이 이렇게 무너질 거라고는 이스라엘도 상상 못했을 것 같은데, 언젠가가 아닌 언제든지 이란을 때릴 준비를 하며 온갖 정보를 다 수집하고 업데이트하고 타격계획을 수립하고 업데이트하고 있었다는 게 정말 대단합니다.

[강준구]

1. F-35는 저피탐성을 활용하여 정찰기처럼 사용 되었고,
2. 장거리 공격을 위해 confirmal tank가 부착된 F-16I가 필요하며,
3. 이스라엘도 MOAB (GBU-57)이 필요하다..라는 점이 눈길을 끕니다.

F-35가 공격에 투입 되어야 할 정도로 수준 높은 방공망이 없으면, 35는 정찰 및 목표물 획득하고, 굳이 와일드 위즐 역할을 하느라 위치를 드러내지 않아도 됨.
F-16I는 복좌기라 야간 타격, 장시간 비행에 유리하며, 복좌 채용으로 줄어든 연료 탑재량은 confirmal 탱크로 보상.
마지막으로 MOAB은 떨구기 위해 C-130이라도 개조하려할지 궁금합니다. 추가 도입하는 F-15EX 계열기에 무거운 무기를 달아줄 것 같은데, 이걸로 만족이 안되나보네요.

[백선호]

F-35I가 F-15, F-16에게 그냥 링크 16으로 표적 정보, 위협 정보들을 보내줬을라나요?

https://cafe.daum.net/NTDS/5q1/1001

[백선호]

'SEAD랑 counter-air는 F-35 네가 해라, 네가 길 닦아 놓으면 내가 (국산 항공기) F-35에는 달지 못하는 아주 아주 큰 폭탄 달고 가서 벙커 부술께'하는 식의 역할 분담 망상이 갑자기 생각나네요. ㅎㅎ