[스크립트]AFN오전11:00(9/23)Oprah Winfrey Show

[주리]

게스트 : 마돈나

[CAPTIONING MADE POSSIBLE BY
KING WORLD]
OPRAH: IT'S BEEN FIVE YEARS
SINCE I TALKED TO HER.
SHE'S HERE.
AND NOW MADONNA IS GIVING IT UP.
>> YOU KNOW, SHE'S ONLY TALKING
TO YOU.
OPRAH: FOR THE FIRST TIME, WHAT
SHE SAYS ABOUT THAT KISS.
IS EVERYBODY IN THIS ROOM SEEN
THE KISS?
>> THIS IS OUR PRIMARY CLOSE-UP
CAMERA.
OPRAH: MARRIAGE, MOTHERHOOD, HER
LATEST PASSION.
>> LET'S GET THE DANCERS IN
PLACE.
>> WE HAVE SPEED.
>> I'M WITH MADONNA.
>> I'M READY.
>> WE'RE READY, OPRAH.
>> STAND BY.
>> FIVE, FOUR, THREE --
OPRAH: A WHOLE NEW SIDE OF
MADONNA.
GET INTO THE GROOVE
LET ME SHOW YOU SOME MOVES
TAKE IT FROM ME
YEAH
GET UP ON YOUR FEET
GET INTO THE BEAT
THIS IS HOW IT SHOULD BE
GET INTO THE GROOVE
LET ME SHOW YOU SOME MOVES
JUST TAKE IT FROM ME
YEAH
GET UP ON YOUR FEET
LET ME STEP TO THE BEAT
SHOW YOU HOW IT SHOULD BE
GET INTO THE GROOVE
LET ME SHOW YOU SOME MOVES
JUST TAKE IT FROM ME
YEAH
GET UP ON YOUR FEET
LET ME STEP TO THE BEAT
OPRAH: WHOO!
[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]
HOW'S YOUR HEAD?
THANK YOU, DANCERS.
OKAY.
[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]
VERY GOOD.
WHOO.
TAKE A BOW.
TAKE A BOW.
THIS IS THE TEAM WHO BACKED UP
MADONNA AND MISSY ELLIOTT IN
THEIR NEW GROOVIN' GAP
COMMERCIAL.
YES, THANK YOU SO MUCH.
TODAY IS THE SECOND DAY OF OUR
18TH SEASON, AND SHE'S HERE!
[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]
SHE'S HERE!
SHE IS HERE.
SHE IS HERE.
[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]
THAT'S RIGHT.
IT'S HER ONE AND ONLY INTERVIEW
ABOUT HER NEW PASSION.
PLEASE WELCOME MADONNA!
EVERYBODY COMES TO HOLLYWOOD
GOT TO MAKE IT IN THE NEIGHBOR
HD
OPRAH: WHOO!
[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]
GET INTO THE GROOVE
LET ME SHOW YOU SOME MOVES
JUST TAKE IT FROM ME
YEAH
GET UP ON YOUR FEET
LET ME STEP TO THE BEAT SNOOET.
OPRAH: GOOD, GOOD.
HEY.
GOOD TO SEE YOU.
GOOD TO SEE YOU.
[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]
OKAY.
THANKS, GAP DANCERS.
WHOO, WHOO.
[APPLAUSE]
>> THAT'S A SURPRISE.
OPRAH: THAT'S A SURPRISE.
THAT WAS FUN.
ANYONE HERE NOT SEE THE KISS?
OKAY.
>> I HAVEN'T SEEN IT.
I DID IT.
I DIDN'T SEE IT.
OPRAH: YOU DID IT AND YOU
HAVEN'T SEEN IT.
>> OKAY.
OPRAH: I DIDN'T SEE IT, EITHER.
I THOUGHT I WAS THE ONLY PERSON
IN THE WORLD WHO HADN'T SEEN IT,
SO I SAID TO MY PRODUCERS, THEY
SAID YOU'RE THE ONLY PERSON IN
THE WORLD WHO HASN'T SEEN IT.
JOE, ROLL THE TAPE FOR THE FOUR
OF US IN THE ROOM, INCLUDING
MADONNA, WHO HAVE NOT SEEN IT.
SHINE YOUR LIGHT NOW
THIS TIME IT'S GOT TO BE GOOD
YOU GET IT RIGHT NOW
OH, YEAH
THIS IS HOLLYWOOD
EVERYBODY COMES TO HOLLYWOOD
THEY WANT TO MAKE IT IN THE
NEIGHBORHOOD
THEY LIKE THE SMELL OF IT IN
HOLLYWOOD
I COULDN'T HURT YOU
AND IT LOOKS SO GOOD
[APPLAUSE]
OPRAH: OKAY.
[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]
OPRAH: OKAY.
OPRAH: THAT'S IT.
OKAY, SO THE WORLD IS STILL
TALKING ABOUT IT.
AND IT'S ALMOST, WHAT, TWO WEEKS
LATER?
>> I GOT ON A PLANE AND WEPT TO
SCOTLAND THAT NIGHT, SO I'VE
BEEN OBLIVIOUS UNTIL THIS
MOMENT.
OPRAH: REALLY.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: DID YOU KNOW THAT IT WAS
LIKE ON THE FRONT PAGE OF THE --
>> I HAD NO IDEA THAT IT WAS
GOING TO CAUSE THE -- WELL, THE
RUCKUS THAT IT CAUSED.
OPRAH: I MEAN --
>> IT WAS JUST A FRIENDLY KISS.
OPRAH: AND YOU --
>> IT REALLY WAS.
I SWEAR TO GOD.
OPRAH: NOT ONLY WAS IT A RUCKUS,
BUT IT'S LIKE MAJOR NEWS
STORIES.
I HEAR THAT IT'S BEEN LIKE
RUNNING ON CLIPS OVER AND OVER
AND OVER AGAIN IN THIS COUNTRY.
BUT YOU ARE TOTALLY OBLIVIOUS.
>> YEAH.
THERE MUST BE A LACK OF NEWS
STORIES OR SOMETHING, RIGHT?
OPRAH: NOW, WAS THAT PLANNED OR
WAS IT SPONTANEOUS, OR WHAT WAS
IT?
WHAT WAS THAT?
>> UM, BASICALLY, IT WAS
SUPPOSED TO -- YOU KNOW, I WAS
THE GROOM, AND I HADWO BRIDES,
RIGHT?
SO THE GROOM AND THE BRIDE ARE
SUPPOSED TO KISS.
AND IT WAS JUST MEANT TO BE A
PLAYFUL KIND OF IRONIC COMMENT
ON THE BRIDE AND GROOM KISSING,
BECAUSE I HAD TWO BRIDES.
I WAS GOING TO KISS BOTH OF MY
BRIDES.
ALL THE REHEARSALS WE DID, IT
WAS VERY, YOU KNOW, RIGHT?
AND --
OPRAH: THAT WAS MORE THAN THAT.
>> I KNOW.
I KNOW THAT, BUT IF BRITNEY
LOOKS LIKE SHE'S, YOU KNOW,
KISSING ME IN AN AGGRESSIVE
MANNER, IT WAS A SURPRISE TO ME.
I SWEAR TO GOD!
[LAUGHTER AND APPLAUSE]
OPRAH: OKAY.
>> AND, YOU KNOW, I'M A
SHOWGIRL.
AFTER 20 YEARS IN SHOW BUSINESS,
WE LEARN TO ROLL WITH THE
PUNCHES.
OPRAH: ABSOLUTELY, OH, RIGHT.
>> IF YOU HAVE A LEMON, YOU MAKE
LEMONADE.
IF SOMEONE COMES TOWARD YOU WITH
THEIR LIPS SLIGHTLY PARTED, YOU
HAVE TO KISS THEM.
OPRAH: THAT'S THE WAY IT IS.
>> BUT IT WAS TOTALLY MEANT IN
INNOCENCE AND FUN.
AND I DON'T KNOW.
I DON'T KNOW WHY PEOPLE ARE
MAKING SUCH A BIG DEAL ABOUT IT.
OPRAH: YOU REALLY DON'T.
>> I REALLY DON'T!
OPRAH: YOU REALLY DON'T.
AND ARE YOU SURPRISE THE --
>> WELL,ASN'T ANYONE EVER SEEN
TWO GIRLS KISS BEFORE?
OPRAH: I DON'T KNOW IF MOST OF
AMERICA HAS.
HAVE YOU?
OH, NO.
LISTEN, THEY'RE JUST ACTING THIS
HIP BECAUSE YOU'RE HERE.
[LAUGHTER]
>> NO, BUT I MEAN, IT WAS SILLY,
YOU KNOW.
OPRAH: IT WASN'T MEANT TO BE.
YOU WEREN'T TRYING TO MAKE A
STATEMENT OR DO ANYTHING.
>> ABOUT WHAT?
OPRAH: I DON'T KNOW.
I DON'T KNOW.
>> I MADE THOSE STATEMENTS 10
YEARS AGO.
OPRAH: 10 YEARS AGO.
NOW, YOUR DAUGHTER, LOURDES,
MADE HER DEBUT PERFORMANCE ON
THE VIDEO MUSIC AWARDS.
>> SHE WAS A FLOWER GIRL.
OPRAH: I KNOW.
THROWING OUT THE LITTLE FLOWERS.
WAS SHE NERVOUS AT ALL?
>> SHE WAS MORE OBSESSED WITH
HER HAIR THAN HER PERFORMANCE, I
HAVE TO TELL YOU.
SHE'S GOT A HAIR OBSESSION.
OPRAH: WERE YOU NERVOUS FOR HER?
>> UM, I -- YEAH, I HAVE TO SAY
I WAS A LITTLE BIT WORRIED ABOUT
HER DOING IT IN THE FIRST PLACE
BECAUSE I THOUGHT, OH, GOD,
SHE'S GOING TO GO OUT ON STAGE
AND THINK IT'S THE MOST
INCREDIBLE THING IN THE WORLD.
OPRAH: AND THEN LOVE IT AND
THEN --
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: YEAH.
DO YOU NOT WANT HER TO HVE THE
STE?
>> WELL, I JUST WANT HERO HAVE
A NORMAL CHILDHOOD, YOU KNOW.
OPRAH: DO YOU THINK SO FAR
YOU'VE BEEN ABLE TO PRESENT HER
WITH A NORMAL CHILDHOOD?
>> AS NORMAL AS --
OPRAH: AS IT CAN BE.
>> AS IT COULD BE.
WHEN WE GET HOME AND THE DOORS
ARE CLOSED, IT'S -- I WOULD
DEFINITELY SAY -- I MEAN, I
DON'T KNOW WHAT YOUR IDEA OF
NORMAL IS, BUT WE DON'T PLAY UP
THE IDEA THAT THERE ARE
CELEBRITIES LIVING IN THE HOUSE
OR THAT -- WE DON'T TALK ABOUT
FAME.
WE DON'T HAVE MAGAZINES IN THE
HOUSE, AND WE DON'T WATCH
TELEVISION, SO WE'RE CUT OFF
FROM ALL OF THAT.
OPRAH: BUT SHE CERTAINLY IS
AWARE OF BY NOW THE NATURE OF
YOUR FAME, BECAUSE SHE'S OLD
ENOUGH TO UNDERSTAND A LITTLE
BIT MORE ABOUT WHAT THAT MEANS.
>> YEAH, SHE IS.
NO, SHE KNOWS THAT I WORK FOR A
LIVING.
SHE KNOWS I SING AND DANCE FOR A
LIVING.
SHE'S COME TO A MILLION PHOTO
SHOOTS AND VIDEO SHOOTS.
SHE UNDERSTANDS THAT'S MOM'S
WORK.
OPRAH: UH-HUH.
>> AND SHE'SND BASICALLY ACCEPTED
THE -- YOU KNOW, THE PRESENCE OF
PHOTOGRAPHERS ON STREETS.
SHE DOESN'T -- WE NEVER TALK
BIT.
THEY'RE THERE.
THEY'RE LIKE -- WE CALL THEM
BUNNIES.
OPRAH: DO YOU?
>> ARE THE BUNNIES OUT THERE?
MOM, THERE'S BUNNIES OUT THERE.
I'M LIKE, OKAY, THEN WE GO IN
THE HOUSE AND NO ONE EVER
MENTIONS THEM AGAIN.
OPRAH: THAT'S COOL.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: WHEN WE COME BACK, WHAT
MADONNA NEVER THOUGHT SHE'D DO,
SHE IS NOW DOING.
AND IT'S REALLY WONDERFUL.
WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK TO TALK
ABOUT IT WITH MADONNA.
A gardener and a stylist,
do you think I'm satisfied?
AND A DRIVER AND A JET
A TRAINER AND @ BUTLER AND A
BODYGUARD OF FIVE
DO YOU THINK I'M SATISFIED?
I'D LIKE TO EXPRESS MY EXTREME
POINT OF VIEW
I'M NOT A CHRISTIAN AND I'M NOT
A JEW
[APPLAUSE]
OPRAH: THAT WAS A SONG "AMERICAN
LIFE" FROM MADONNA'S NEW C.D.,
"AMERICAN LIFE."
WHAT WERE YOU SAYING IN THAT
SONG?
>> BASICALLY, THE IDEA IS THAT I
HAVE ALL OF THESE THINGS THAT
MONEY CAN BUY, BUT I REALIZED
THAT THOSE AREN'T THE THINGS
THAT MAKE YOU HAPPY, THAT MAKE
YOU FEEL FULFILLED.
AND THAT NOTHING IN THE MATERIAL
WORLD WILL EVER MAKE US HAPPY.
OPRAH: YOU ARE THE MATERIAL
GIRL.
>> UM, WELL, THAT WAS MEANT TO
BE IRONIC.
OPRAH: UH-HUH.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: NO.
BUT --
>> I'M SO NOT THE MATERIAL GIRL.
I SUPPOSE TO A CERTAIN EXTENT
THERE WERE MANY YEARS IN MY LIFE
I MEAN, I'M SURE I DON'T SUPPOSE
WHERE I THOUGHT THAT THOSE
THINGS WOULD -- THAT FAME AND
FORTUNE AND PUBLIC APPROVAL
WOULD BRING ME HAPPINESS.
OPRAH: YEAH.
>> AND THEN -- WELL, YOU KNOW,
ONE DAY YOU WAKE UP AND YOU
REALIZE IT DOESN'T.
OPRAH: WHAT WAS THAT DAY FOR
YOU?
>> I THINK IT'S AFTER I MADE
"EVITA."
I WON A GOLDEN GLOBE.
I WAS PREGNANT.
I WAS ABOUT TO HAVE A BABY.
IT SEEMED LIKE LIFE WAS
HUNKY-DORY.
I HAD EVERYTHING.
IT SEEMED LIKE SOMETHING WAS
MISSING.
OPRAH: WHAT WAS THAT SOMETHING?
>> AN UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT MY
PLACE IN THE WORLD REALLY WAS.
UP UNTIL THAT POINT, I FELT
MYSELF BEING SORT OF CONTROLLED
BY THE UPS AND DOWNS THAT HAPPEN
TO ME IN MY LIFE.
THINGS WERE GOING GREAT.
I WAS HAPPY F. SOMEBODY SAID
SOMETHING NEGATIVE ABOUT ME IN
THE NEWSPAPERS, I GOT DEPRESSED.
IF I HAD A RELATIONSHIP THAT WAS
FUN AND GOOD AND EVERYTHING WAS
HUNKY-DORY, I WAS HAPPY.
IF THAT RELATIONSHIP FELL APART,
THEN I WAS NOT HAPPY.
AND I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND -- I
DIDN'T FEEL LIKE I WAS IN
CONTROL OF MY LIFE.
OPRAH: SO YOU WERE BEING DEFINED
BY ALL THE EXTERNAL THINGS.
>> EXACTLY.
BY EXTERNAL THINGS.
OPRAH: SO WHAT HAPPENED AFTER
YOU REALIZED THERE'S MORE TO
LIFE THAN ALL OF THIS STUFF?
WAS THERE SOMETHING IN
PARTICULAR THAT HAPPENED THAT
CAUSED THIS?
>> I THINK PROBABLY THE BIGGEST
THING WAS THE FACT THAT I WAS
ABOUT TO BECOME A PARENT.
OPRAH: UH-HUH.
>> AND I WANTED TO UNDERSTAND
WHAT I WAS GOING TO TEACH MY
DAUGHTER, AND I DIDN'T REALLY
UNDERSTAND WHERE I STOOD ON
THINGS.
OPRAH: UH-HUH.
>> I WANTED TO UNDERSTAND WHAT
THE MEANING OF HAPPINESS WAS AND
WHAT AND HOW I WAS GOING TO GO
ABOUT FINDING TRUE AND LASTING
HAPPINESS IN MY LIFE AND HOW I
WAS GOING TO TEACH THAT TO MY
DAUGHTER.
OPRAH: WHAT DO YOU THINK NOW
WHEN YOU LOOK BACK AT SOME OF
THOSE YEARS?
I MEAN, ALL THE LITTLE GIRLS WHO
WERE IMITATING YOU AND WALKING
AROUND WITH THE BREASTS POINTED
OUT IN THEIR BRAS, BRAS ON THE
OUTSIDE OF THEIR CLOTHES AND
THE -- YOU KNOW --
>> UH-HUH.
OPRAH: BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T HAVE
WHAT YOU HAD, BUT WANTED
WHATEVER THEY THOUGHT, THE
ILLUSION THAT YOU HAD.
>> RIGHT.
OPRAH: THEY WANTED THAT.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: AND WERE NOT LOOKING
BENEATH THE SURFACE OF ANYTHING.
>> RIGHT.
OPRAH: OTHER THAN I WANT, I WANT
I WANT.
>> EXACTLY.
OPRAH: WHAT DO YOU THINK WHEN
YOU LOOK BACK ON THAT TIME IN
YOUR --
>> WHEN I LOOK BACK AT IT, I
THINK, WOW, I HAD A HUGE DESIRE,
A HUGE DESIRE TO RECEIVE, YOU
KNOW.
I -- I HAD BIG DREAMS.
ITCHES AMBITIOUS.
I WAS COURAGEOUS.
I WAS PROVOCATIVE, BUT I DON'T
FEEL LIKE I HAD THE WHOLE
PICTURE OF LIFE.
I DID THE BEST THAT I COULD WITH
THE KNOWLEDGE THAT I HAD.
OPRAH:.
AND WHEN YOU KNOW BETTER, YOU DO
BETTER.
>> EXACTLY.
OPRAH: WAS IT YOUR CHILDREN OR
JUST THIS DESIRE?
BECAUSE WHAT I WAS FOUND IS SEEK
AND YE SHALL FIND AND KNOCK AND
THE DOORS SHALL BE OPENED TO
YOU.
WAS IT THE CULMINATION OF HAVING
A CHILD, WANTING SOMETHING
DEEPER IN YOUR LIFE?
>> YEAH, IT'S A COMBINATION OF,
YOU KNOW, BEING PREGNANT, OF
WANTING TO REALLY -- WANTING TO
FIND MY SOUL MATE, AND WANTING A
FEELING OF LASTING HAPPINESS.
OPRAH: YEAH.
>> BUT I'M NOT DOING IT ON MY
OWN.
I MEAN, I HAVE TO SAY THAT, YOU
KNOW, THERE ARE NO MISTAKES.
I THINK EVERYTHING HAPPENS FOR A
REASON, AND WHEN I WAS -- WHEN I
WAS PREGNANT WITH MY DAUGHTER,
BASICALLY THAT'S WHEN I STARTED
TO STUDY KABBALAH, AND IT
HAPPENED -- EVERYTHING HAPPENED
TO ME AT ONCE IN THIS ONE LIKE
SECTION OF MY LIFE WHERE I HAD A
DEEP YEARNING TO UNDERSTAND WHAT
I WAS DOING.
OPRAH: WHAT IS KABBALAH?
>> IT'S A BELIEF SYSTEM THAT
GIVES YOU TOOLS TO DEAL WITH
LIFE.
AND THERE ARE A LOT OF
PRINCIPLES IN KABBALAH THAT
RESEMBLE CONCEPTS IN
CHRISTIANITY OR IN BUDDHISM.
OPRAH: AND THE FUNDAMENTAL
PRINCIPLE IS WHAT, THAT YOU ARE
RESPONSIBLE FOR YOUR --
>> RIGHT, I'LL GIVE YOU TWO
FUNDAMENTAL PRINCIPLES.
ONE IS THE ISSUE OF
RESPONSIBILITY.
OPRAH: RIGHT.
>> YES, THAT WE'RE RESPONSIBLE
FOR EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENS TO
US.
OPRAH: RIGHT.
>> OKAY.
AND THAT WE HAVE TO TAKE
RESPONSIBILITY FOR EVERYTHING
THAT HAPPENS TO US.
OPRAH: RIGHT.
>> FOR INSTANCE, GOOD THINGS
HAPPEN TO US.
WE WIN AN AWARD, WE WIN A
BASKETBALL GAME.
WE GET A PROMOTION.
OPRAH: RIGHT.
>> WE MEET OUR -- THE LOVE OF
OUR LIVES AND WE TAKE OWNERSHIP
OF THAT.
WE GO, I DID THAT.
I ATTRACTED THAT.
OPRAH: YES.
>> THAT'S BECAUSE OF ME.
OPRAH: YES.
>> THEN BAD THINGS HAPPEN TO US.
OPRAH: RIGHT.
AND YOU SAY --
>> AN ILLNESS.
WE GET FIRED.
THIS HAPPENED.
AND THAT'S -- WE'RE DIVORCED
FROM THAT.
WE'RE DISCONNECTED FROM THAT.
WE DON'T TAKE RESPONSIBILITY.
THAT'S JUST SOMETHING THAT
HAPPENED TO US.
AND OBVIOUSLY THAT'S AN ABSURD
IDEA.
OPRAH: RIGHT, YES.
>> SO, FIRST OF ALL, WE TAKE
RESPONSIBILITY FOR EVERYTHING
AND WE UNDERSTAND THAT AS WE CAN
DRAW POSITIVE, WE CAN DRAW
NEGATIVE.
OPRAH: AND THAT THERE'S NOTHING
HAPPENING OUT OF ORDER WITH YOU.
>> NO.
OPRAH: OKAY.
THIS IS WHAT I BELIEVE.
I DIDN'T KNOW I BELIEVED IN
KABBALAH, BUT THIS IS -- THESE
ARE MY BELIEFS.
>> GOOD.
WELL, YOU ARE.
YOU'RE A CLOSET KABBALALIST.
THE OTHER PRINCIPLE IS THAT
THERE IS AN ALL GIVING, ALL
LOVING FORCE.
YOU COULD CALL IT GOD.
OPRAH: I BELIEVE THAT, TOO.
>> THE LIGHT FORCE OF GOD.
OPRAH: YEAH.
>> THE ENERGY.
YOU KNOW, WHATEVER.
KABBALAHISTS CALL IT THE LIGHT,
BUT ESSENTIALLY IT IS GOD.
SO THE IDEA IS THAT THIS FORCE,
THIS GOD IS ALL LOVING AND ALL
GIVING.
WHEN WE DISCONNECT FROM THIS
FORCE, THAT'S WHEN WE HAVE
CHAOS.
THAT'S WHEN WE INVITE PAIN AND
SUFFERING INTO OUR LIVES.
OPRAH: OKAY.
>> AND THAT LEADS ME TO THE
CHILDREN'S BOOKS, BECAUSE NOW
YOU'RE PROBABLY WONDERING HOW
CAN I DISCONNECT, WHAT'S THE WAY
I COULD DISCONNECT FROM GOD OR
THE LIGHT FORCE OF GOD OR
WHATEVER.
WELL, ONE OF THEM IS JEALOUSY
AND ENVY.
COVETING WHAT SOMEBODY ELSE HAS.
OPRAH: YEAH.
>> NOT BEING GRATEFUL FOR THE
THINGS YOU HAVE AND GOING --
LOOKING AT WHAT THEY HAVE AND
NOT BEING SATISFIED, WANTING
WHAT THEY HAVE.
OPRAH: AND THAT'S WHAT LEADS
US -- THIS IS A BEAUTIFUL SEGUE.
>> AND THAT IS WHAT "THE ENGLISH
ROSES" IS ABOUT.
OPRAH: COMING UP, MEET MADONNA'S
NEW GIRLS.
OPRAH: SO, JUST YESTERDAY, JUST
YESTERDAY, JUST YESTERDAY,
MADONNA WAS IN THE NEWS AGAIN
WHEN SHE MADE PUBLISHING
HISTORY WITH THE RELEASE OF HER
FIRST CHILDREN'S BOOK.
IT'S CALLED "THE ENGLISH
ROSES."
WHO WOULD HAVE THOUGHT MADONNA
WOULD HAVE EVER DONE A
CHILDREN'S BOOK?
WELL, SHE KEEPS SURPRISING THE
WORLD.
THE BOOK IS REALLY, REALLY
CHARMING.
IT'S A STORY ABOUT FIVE
11-YEAR-OLD GIRLS WHO LEARN
ABOUT JEALOUSY AND ENVY AND
FRIENDSHIP.
MADONNA DEDICATED THE BOOK TO
HER OWN CHILDREN, AND MADONNA,
PLEASE INTRODUCE US TO "THE
ENGLISH ROSES," WILL YOU?
>> STARTING FROM THE RIGHT,
GRACE, CHARLOTTE WITH THE BANGS,
AMY WITH THE RED HAIR, NICOLE
WITH THE GLASSES, AND THEN WHEN
ALL THESE GIRLS OVERCOME THEIR
JEALOUSY AND ENVY, THEY BECOME
FRIENDS WITH BINAH, WHO BECOMES
THE FIFTH ENGLISH ROSE.
OPRAH: I READ THIS WHOLE STORY.
I THINK IT'S REALLY, REALLY
BEAUTIFULLY DONE.
YOU DID A GREAT JOB.
>> THANK YOU.
OPRAH: A REALLY GREAT JOB.
AND I KNOW A FEW THINGS ABOUT
BOOKS.
SO THIS IS REALLY A REALLY GOOD
JOB.
WHAT'S REALLY INTERESTING TO ME
IS WHEN I WAS READING THE STORY
ABOUT "THE ENGLISH ROSES" AND
BINAH, ARE YOU BINAH IN THE
STORY?
>> NO.
OPRAH: YOU'RE NOT.
>> NO.
OPRAH: OKAY.
>> IF IT -- I'M NOT IN THE
STORY.
OPRAH: OKAY.
OKAY.
WE HAVE "THE ENGLISH ROSES."
AND THEY HAD THIS OTHER GIRL
THAT THEY KNEW, AND HER NAME
WAS BINAH, AND HERE ARE SOME
THINGS YOU SHOULD KNOW ABOUT
HER.
SHE WAS VERY, VERY BEAUTIFUL.
SHE HAD LONG, SILKY HAIR AND
SKIN LIKE MILK AND HONEY.
SHE WAS AN EXCELLENT STUDENT
AND VERY GOOD AT SPORTS.
SHE WAS ALWAYS KIND TO PEOPLE.
SHE WAS SPECIAL.
BUT SHE WAS SAD BECAUSE EVEN
THOUGH SHE WAS THE MOST
BEAUTIFUL GIRL ANYONE HAD EVER
SEEN, SHE WAS ALSO VERY LONELY.
SHE HAD NO FRIENDS AND
EVERYWHERE SHE WENT, SHE WAS
ALONE.
BY NOW YOU'RE PROBABLY
WONDERING WHAT'S THE BIG DEAL?
IF SHE WAS SO NICE, WHY DIDN'T
THE ENGLISH ROSES INVITE HER
OVER FOREA CUP OF TEA.
LISTEN, I ALREADY TOLD YOU WHY,
BECAUSE THEY WERE A LITTLE
JEALOUS.
I WAS JUST WONDERING, BECAUSE
SHE WAS ONE OF THOSE GIRLS WHO
SEEMED TO HAVE EVERYTHING ON
THE OUTSIDE WHETHER OR NOT
YOU'RE INCORPORATING SOME OF
YOURSELF?
>> I MAY HAVE UNCONSCIOUSLY
DONE THAT.
OPRAH: OKAY.
>> TO TELL YOU THE TRUTH,
PROBABLY IT WAS MORE INSPIRED
BY MY DAUGHTER.
OPRAH: REALLY.
>> BECAUSE SHE GOES TO THE
FRENCH SCHOOL IN LONDON, AND
THERE'S MOST OF THE CHILDREN
ARE FRENCH THERE.
IT'S VERY INTERNATIONAL, BUT
THERE'S A LITTLE CORE GROUP OF
GIRLS THAT STICK TOGETHER THAT
ARE ENGLISH.
AND I WENT IN FOR A MEETING
WITH THE TEACHER TO TALK ABOUT
MY DAUGHTER.
IT WAS LIKE ONE OF THOSE EVERY
FEW MONTHS MEETINGS THAT YOU
HAVE.
AND SHE TOLD ME -- I SAID WHO
ARE HER FRIENDS?
SHE SAID SHE HANGS OUT WITH THE
ENGLISH ROSES.
I SAID, WHAT'S THAT?
SHE SAID, OH, IT'S JUST THIS
GROUP OF ENGLISH GIRLS THAT
STICK TOGETHER IN THE SCHOOL.
I THOUGHT, THAT'S A CUTE IDEA.
YOU KNOW, LIKE I JUST HAD THIS
IDEA, THE ENGLISH ROSES.
AND --
OPRAH: WHY ARE THEY CALLED
THAT?
>> BECAUSE THEY ARE THE FOUR
ENGLISH GIRLS THAT STUCK
TOGETHER IN A FRENCH SCHOOL.
OPRAH: OKAY.
>> AND, YOU KNOW, THE TYPICAL
ENGLISH BEAUTY IS AN ENGLISH
ROSE WITH THE PALE COMPLEXION
AND ALL THAT STUFF.
OPRAH: RIGHT.
>> SO -- BUT I ALSO KNOW THAT
MY DAUGHTER IN SCHOOL AND ON
THE PLAYGROUND WAS OFTEN -- IS
OFTEN SINGLED OUT, YOU KNOW,
BECAUSE I'M HER MOTHER, AND I
THINK SOMETIMES CHILDREN
UNCONSCIOUSLY TREAT HER
DIFFERENTLY BECAUSE THEY
PERCEIVE THAT SHE HAS MORE OR
SHE HAS EVERYTHING, AND SO I
THINK I KIND OF INCORPORATED
THAT INTO THE STORY, THE IDEA
OF THE ENGLISH ROSES, THE FACT
THAT BINAH'S MOTHER DIED WHEN
SHE WAS YOUNG.
I USED THAT FROM MY OWN
CHILDHOOD.
SO IT'S A MISHMASH OF
EXPERIENCES, WHICH IS WHAT
WRITING IS.
OPRAH: SO YOU CAN UNDERSTAND
WHY I MIGHT THINK BINAH MIGHT
HAVE SOMETHING TO DO --
>> I CAN ASSURE YOU I NEVER
THOUGHT I WAS BEAUTIFUL AS A
CHILD, SO I WOULDN'T -- I
DIDN'T WRITE ABOUT --
OPRAH: I WAS JUST THINKING
PARTS OF THE STORY MIGHT HAVE
SOMETHING TO DO.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: IT REALLY WAS INSPIRED
BY YOUR OWN CHILDREN AND
READING TO YOUR OWN CHILDREN AT
NIGHT.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: YEAH.
>> I MEAN, FOR ME, TO BE ABLE
TO WRITE THESE BOOKS, IS A HUGE
BLESSING BECAUSE, FIRST OF ALL,
I GET TO SHARE THINGS THAT I'VE
LEARNED WITH CHILDREN AND
THAT'S ONE THING.
AND THE OTHER IS THAT I HAVE
GREAT STORIES IN MY OPINION TO
READ TO MY CHILDREN AT BED.
OPRAH: YES.
SO WHAT AGE -- IF YOU WANTED TO
START READING THIS TO YOUR
CHILDREN, WHAT AGE WOULD THAT
BE?
>> I STARTED WRITING THAT WHEN
MY DAUGHTER WAS 6.
SHE'S ALMOST 7.
AND SHE WAS BASICALLY MY
CO-EDITOR.
OPRAH: ON THIS.
>> YES, ABSOLUTELY.
OPRAH: BECAUSE SHE WOULD TELL
YOU WHEN THINGS WERE BORING.
>> MOM, THAT'S BORING.
YOU SAID THAT ALREADY.
GET RID OF THAT BIT.
[LAUGHTER]
OPRAH: THAT'S GREAT.
>> I'M LIKE, OKAY.
AND SHE LOVED -- SHE LOVED MORE
THAN ANYTHING ALL THE
ACTIVITIES THAT THEY DID.
OPRAH: IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU HAVE
A GREAT RELATIONSHIP WITH YOUR
DAUGHTER.
>> IT'S GOOD.
NO, I DO.
I HAVE A GREAT RELATIONSHIP
WITH HER.
SHE'S -- SHE'S A LITTLE BIT
MORE OBSESSED WITH HER HAIR
THAN I'D LIKE HER TO BE.
I DON'T KNOW WHERE THAT COMES
FROM.
OPRAH: IT'S A PHASE.
>> I HOPE SO.
OPRAH: NEXT, WHAT HAPPENED WHEN
MADONNA INTERVIEWED HER HUSBAND,
GUY RITCHIE, ON CAMERA.
SEE, THAT TAPE WHEN WE COME
BACK.
WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK.
>> I ALWAYS DREAMED OF WORKING
WITH MADONNA BECAUSE I ALWAYS
FELT LIKE IF I HAD ANY KIND OF
CONNECTION WITH ANY ARTIST, IT
WOULD BE MADONNA.
EVERYBODY COMES TO HOLLYWOOD
YOU WANT TO MAKE IT IN THE
NEIGHBORHOOD
>> WHAT SHE DO IN HER FIELD,
SHE'S EDGY, SHE'S NOT SCARED TO
TAKE RISKS, AND THAT'S PRETTY
MUCH ME ON THE HIP-HOP, RAP
SIDE.
WHO THAT BE
MISDEMEANOR --
>> THEY BOTH HAVE THE BLING
BLING.
MADONNA'S WEARING $20 MILLION
WORTH OF ICE.
>> SHE'S WEARING A $50,000
WALLET CHAIN.
>> MADONNA LOOKS OVER TO ME AND
SAYS I'M NOT GOING TO BE
OUT-BLINGED BY MISSY.
TAKE IT FROM ME
>> WORKING WITH MADONNA ON THE
GAP COMMERCIAL WAS INCREDIBLE.
FOR ME TO HAVE A CHANCE TO BE
ON THE SAME STAGE, TO BE IN A
COMMERCIAL WITH MADONNA IS A
BLESSING.
>> THANK YOU VERY, VERY MUCH.
THAT IS A WRAP.
GET INTO THE GROOVE
[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]
OPRAH: WHOA.
THAT WAS SOME BEHIND-THE-SCENES
FOOTAGE OF THE MUCH TALKED
ABOUT GAP AD STARRING MADONNA
AND HIP-HOPPER MISSY ELLIOTT.
YOU JUST DID THE SPLITS AT THE
END OF THAT.
>> YEP, IN SIX-INCH PLATFORMS.
OPRAH: YEAH.
YOU ARE IN THE BEST SHAPE OF
ANY WOMAN I'VE EVER SEEN.
>> REALLY?
OPRAH: YES, YOU ARE.
DO YOU KNOW, I SAW IN --
[APPLAUSE]
ANY WOMAN I'VE EVER SEEN
REGARDLESS OF WHAT AGE.
I SAW -- I WAS LOOKING AT THE
"W" MAGAZINE RECENTLY AND THERE
WAS A PICTURE OF YOU ON A TABLE
WITH YOUR LEG --
>> BEHIND MY HEAD.
OPRAH: I HADN'T SEEN IT, BUT
GAYLE, MY BEST FRIEND GAYLE
BROUGHT IT TO ME.
THIS IS A FUNNY THING.
GAYLE KNEW YOU WERE COMING.
SO LAST NIGHT, LAST NIGHT --
MADONNA, LAST NIGHT GAYLE
BROUGHT THIS PICTURE TO ME, AND
SHE SAID -- GAYLE SAID, OKAY, I
WANT YOU TO GET UP ON THE TABLE.
GAYLE SAID, I'M GOING TO BREAK
YOUR LEG.
AND THEN WE'LL TAKE A PICTURE.
DID THAT HURT?
>> NO, IT DIDN'T.
OPRAH: THAT DIDN'T HURT.
>> NO.
I DO IT EVERY MORNING.
OPRAH: YOU DO THAT EVERY
MORNING.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: OKAY.
>> ACTUALLY, I PUT THE OTHER
LEG BEHIND MY HEAD AT THE SAME
TIME.
OPRAH: YOU DO.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: OKAY.
IS THERE A PICTURE OF HER
SQUATTING?
THERE'S A PICTURE OF MADONNA
SQUATTING --
>> IT'S CALLED YOGA.
OPRAH: PICTURE OF HER SQUATTING
WITH THE POLE.
LAST NIGHT GAYLE WAS WALKING
AROUND SAYING LET'S JUST TRY
AND SEE IF WE CAN DO IT.
I WAS GOING YOU ARE OUT OF YOUR
MIND.
WE HAVE THE PICTURE OF MADONNA
SQUATTING BY THE POLE JUST LIKE
THAT.
GAYLE GOES, I THINK EVEN THAT'S
HARD.
>> THAT WAS ACTUALLY THE
EASIEST POSE OF ALL OF THEM.
OPRAH: IT DOESN'T HURT YOUR
KNEES AT ALL?
>> NO.
OPRAH: I HAD GAYLE IN THE
KITCHEN BETWEEN TWO COUNTERS,
REALLY, TRYING TO SQUAT.
I KEPT SAILING, NO, YOUR BUTT'S
TOO HIGH.
LOOK AT THE PICTURE.
>> IT'S EASIER TO SQUAT WHEN
YOU HAVE HEELS ON.
OPRAH: IS IT?
WHY?
WHY?
>> BECAUSE THE HEEL LIFTS --
THE HEEL ON YOUR SHOE LIFTS
YOUR HEEL UP AND YOU HAVE
FURTHER DOWN TO GO.
OPRAH: YOU CAN PUSH YOUR BUTT
DOWN FURTHER.
>> I'M WEARING HEELS RIGHT NOW.
IT'S EASY FOR ME TO SIT LIKE
THIS.
OPRAH: GO RIGHT AHEAD.
>> OKAY.
HI.
OPRAH: THAT'S GREAT.
>> WE'RE JUST GOING TO CONDUCT
THE INTERVIEW LIKE THIS.
OPRAH: THAT'S CALLED YOGA.
BUT WE DID A YOGA CLASS
TOGETHER ONCE, GAYLE AND I, AND
WE CAME OUT OF THE CLASS.
GAYLE SAID, "I DID NOT LIKE
THAT."
WHAT PART DIDN'T YOU LIKE?
WHAT DID YOU SAY, GAYLE?
>> YOU'RE BENT UP LIKE A
PRETZEL.
THAT IS SO UNCOMFORTABLE.
OPRAH: GAYLE SAID I DON'T LIKE
THE BENDING OR THE STRETCHING
PART.
>> OTHER THAN THAT, IT'S GREAT.
>> THEN YOU DON'T LIKE THE YOGA
PART.
>> I MEAN, PROBABLY FROM THE
OUTSIDE TO LOOK AT IT, IT
PROBABLY LOOKS RATHER
UNDIGNIFIED, BUT IT'S ACTUALLY
REALLY GOOD FOR YOU.
OPRAH: THAT'S WHAT'S KEPT YOU
AGELESS.
>> WELL, I THINK THAT'S PART OF
IT.
PART OF IT IS THAT.
THE OTHER PART IS JUST MY
ATTITUDE.
OPRAH: YEAH.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE A
GREAT ATTITUDE, BUT THEY ARE
AGING.
>> THEY DON'T HAVE A GREAT
ENOUGH ATTITUDE.
OPRAH: IT'S ATTITUDE, BUT IT'S
ALSO --
>> IT'S LIFESTYLE.
I MEAN, IT'S PARTLY THAT.
IT'S PARTLY, YOU KNOW,
BLESSINGS FROM GOD.
OPRAH: ARE YOU ON
MACROBIOTIC --
>> I WAS STRICT FOR A COUPLE OF
YEARS.
I HAD TO HAVE A LAMBCHOP, SO
NOW I'M -- I FELL OFF THE MACRO
WAGON.
I'M FITTING TO GET BACK ON.
OPRAH: FITTING TO GET --
[LAUGHTER]
WE'LL BE BACK TO SEE WHAT
HAPPENED WHEN MADONNA AND HER
HUSBAND, GUY RITCHIE,
INTERVIEWED EACH OTHER.
I PROMISE, WE'LL LOOK AT THAT
WHEN WE COME BACK.
OPRAH: HAVING A LITTLE CHAT
WITH MADONNA TODAY.
MADONNA, MADONNA HAS NOW FOUND
A NEW PASSION THAT SHE IS
TELLING US ABOUT TODAY, AND
SHE'S WRITTEN HER FIRST-EVER
CHILDREN'S BOOK.
IT'S CALLED "THE ENGLISH
ROSES."
AND I READ THAT YOU HAD SAID TO
SOMEONE THAT WRITING THIS BOOK
MADE YOU FEEL LIBERATED, THAT
YOUR CREATIVITY WASN'T
MOTIVATED BY --
>> GREED.
OPRAH: RIGHT.
OR EGO.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: FOR ONE OF THE FIRST
TIMES IN YOUR LIFE.
IS THAT TRUE?
>> YEAH, YEAH, TOTALLY TRUE.
IT WAS ACTUALLY -- YEAH, IT WAS
THE FIRST TIME IN MY LIFE,
BECAUSE I KNEW THAT I WAS GOING
TO WRITE THESE STORIES, AND I
WASN'T GOING TO MAKE ANY MONEY
OUT OF THEM.
OPRAH: THIS IS FIRST IN A
SERIES OF FIVE.
>> FIRST IN A SERIES OF FIVE.
AND I BASICALLY, I WANTED TO
TAKE ALL THE THINGS THAT I'VE
LEARNED OVER THE LAST SEVEN
YEARS AND TURN THEM INTO
STORIES FOR CHILDREN TO INSPIRE
CHILDREN, AND I WANTED TO TAKE
ALL THE MONEY THAT I MADE FROM
THE BOOKS AND GIVE THAT MONEY
TO CHILDREN'S CHARITIES.
OPRAH: UH-HUH.
>> SO FOR ME THIS IS AN AMAZING
CONCEPT, BECAUSE MY ENTIRE
CAREER, FOR THE LAST 20 YEARS,
EVERY TIME I'VE TAKEN A JOB, I
WENT, HOW MUCH MONEY IS IT
GOING TO PAY ME?
AND HOW MUCH -- HOW MUCH TIME
IS IT GOING TO TAKE ME?
AND, I MEAN, WE ALL -- WE WOULD
BE FOOLS AND LIARS IF WE DIDN'T
THINK ABOUT WHAT WE WERE GOING
TO GET OUT OF IT.
AND FOR THE MOST PART WE ALL GO
THROUGH OUR DAYS ONLY DOING
THINGS WITH AN AGENDA.
WHAT AM I GOING TO GET OUT OF
IT?
IF I DO THIS FOR YOU, WHAT ARE
YOU GOING TO DO FOR ME?
SO FOR ME IT WAS INCREDIBLY
LIBERATING TO WRITE THESE
STORIES AND TO KNOW THAT MY
GIFT WAS THAT I WAS GOING TO
GIVE THESE STORIES TO PEOPLE,
AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT HAPPENED,
BECAUSE IT IS THE LAST THING IN
THE WORLD I EVER INTENDED TO DO,
WRITE CHILDREN'S STORIES, BUT I
FELT INCREDIBLY INSPIRED FROM
THE MINUTE I STARTED.
OPRAH: REALLY.
NOW, YOU SEEM TO ME -- I MEAN,
I THINK I INTERVIEWED YOU FIVE
YEARS AGO AND, YOU KNOW, I
DON'T KNOW YOU.
>> I WAS A WHOLE DIFFERENT
PERSON THEN.
OPRAH: YOU'RE DIFFERENT TODAY
THAN YOU WERE THEN.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: YOU SEEM TO BE A
KINDER --
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: GENTLER.
>> REALLY?
OPRAH: YOU REALLY DO.
>> GOOD.
OPRAH: I'M NOT KIDDING.
>> I'M WORKING ON IT.
OPRAH: I'VE BEEN READING SOME
OF THE STUFF.
I THOUGHT IT'S VERY EASY TO SAY
ALL THESE THINGS.
IT'S VERY EASY TO DO THE
KABBALAH TALK, BUT THERE IS --
I WOULD SAY THERE IS -- THERE
IS -- YOU'RE CALMER.
>> UH-HUH.
OPRAH: YOU'RE DEFINITELY MORE
CALM THAN YOU WERE THE LAST
TIME.
>> YEAH.
OPRAH: YOUR ENERGY IS A LOT --
IT'S JUST -- IT'S A SOFTER
VIBRATION COMING FROM YOU.
>> GOOD.
OPRAH: THAN BEFORE.
SO IT'S A GOOD THING.
>> IT'S A VERY GOOD THING.
OPRAH: YEAH.
IT'S A GOOD THING.
NOW, HOW DOES IT AFFECT YOUR
CREATIVITY?
IS IT THE FACT THAT YOU'RE --
THAT THIS CALMNESS AND THIS --
THAT YOU DON'T --
>> I'VE ACTUALLY NEVER FELT
MORE CREATIVE.
OPRAH: UH-HUH.
>> AND I THINK THAT ANOTHER
THING THAT I'VE LEARNED OVER
THE PAST SEVEN YEARS IS THAT
I'M NOT THE OWNER OF MY TALENT.
I'M THE MANAGER OF MY TALENT.
AND IF I LEARN HOW TO MANAGE MY
TALENT CORRECTLY AND I ACCEPT
THAT I'M JUST CHANNELING THINGS
THAT COME FROM GOD, THAT ARE
BLESSINGS FROM GOD, THEY WILL
KEEP FLOWING THROUGH ME.
OPRAH: IT'S LIKE YOU GOT BORN
AGAIN, BUT NOT IN A RELIGIOUS
SENSE.
>> PLEASE NOT IN A RELIGIOUS
SENSE.
OPRAH: YOU KNOW WHAT I'M
SAYING.
>> YEAH, YEAH, YEAH.
OPRAH: YOU OPENED UP TO
SOMETHING DEEPER THAN THE
MATERIAL WORLD.
>> THE MIRACLE OF LIFE, REALLY.
OPRAH: WHAT I REALLY -- WHAT
I'VE READ RECENTLY THAT I
REALLY MOST APPRECIATED HEARING
WAS THAT YOUR -- THAT YOUR
DAUGHTER GOES TO SPIRITUALITY
CLASSES.
>> YEP.
OPRAH: AND, YOU KNOW, AT ONE
TIME I'D THOUGHT ABOUT HAVING
CHILDREN.
I DON'T THINK ABOUT IT ANYMORE.
BUT AT ONE TIME I THOUGHT ABOUT
HAVING CHILDREN, AND THE ONE
REASON I THOUGHT OF HAVING
CHILDREN, THE ONE PRIMARY
REASON, I THOUGHT, WOULD BE
WONDERFUL TO RAISE SOMEONE FROM
THE TIME THAT THEY ARE A BABE
AND BRING THEM UP IN A WORLD
AND TEACH THEM THE POWER OF
THEMSELVES AND THEIR
RELATIONSHIP TO THAT WHICH IS
BIGGER THAN THEMSELVES IN A
VERY SPIRITUAL WAY.
SO WHAT IT SOUNDS LIKE YOUR
DAUGHTER DOES IS SHE GOES TO
SPIRITUALITY CLASSES AND IS
TAUGHT ABOUT --
>> SHE GOES TO THE SPIRITUALITY
FOR KIDS SCHOOL AND BASICALLY
ALL THE MONEY THAT -- I JUST
WANT TO POINT OUT THAT ALL THE
MONEY I MAKE FOR THE KIDS GOES
TO THE SPIRITUALITY FOR KIDS
FOUNDATION.
ONE OF THE PROGRAMS THEY HAVE
IS AN AFTERSCHOOL AND WEEKEND
PROGRAM FOR KIDS BETWEEN THE
AGES OF 6 AND 12, AND THEY GO
TO SCHOOL TO LEARN BASICALLY
LEARN TOOLS FOR DEALING WITH
LIFE.
I WISH TO GOD I HAD KNOWN A LOT
OF THE THINGS THAT MY
DAUGHTER'S LEARNING.
OPRAH: THEY'RE TAUGHT ABOUT
GIVING AND SHARING AND --
>> GICHING, SHARING.
THEY'RE TAUGHT ABOUT THE LAWS
OF CAUSE AND EFFECT.
FOR EVERY ACTION, THERE'S A
REACTION.
OPRAH: I THINK THAT'S BIG.
>> HOW AMAZING IS THAT?
DON'T YOU WISH SOMEONE TOLD YOU
THAT WHEN YOU WERE 6?
OPRAH: TO HAVE GOTTEN THAT WHEN
YOU'RE 6?
>> THEY'RE TAUGHT THERE ARE TWO
FORCES WITHIN ALL OF US.
THERE'S THE GOOD SIDE, THE
LIGHT SIDE, THE SIDE THAT'S
GIVING, CARING AND LOVING, AND
THERE'S THE DARK SIDE, THE
NEGATIVE SIDE, THE OPPONENT.
LET'S CALL IT THE OPPONENT.
SO THEIR JOB IS TO LIKE FOR
THEIR GOOD SIDE, TO GET THEIR
GOOD SIDE TO DEFEAT THEIR BAD
SIDE.
AND WHEN THEY SAY -- DO NAUGHTY
THINGS OR SAY NAUGHTY THINGS,
THAT'S THEIR OPPONENT.
IT'S NOT REALLY THEM.
MY DAUGHTER CAME HOME FROM
SCHOOL, AND ACTUALLY I DON'T
THINK IT WAS RIGHT AFTER SHE
CAME HOME FROM SCHOOL.
IT WAS LATER ON IN THE WEEK.
I WAS IN A GRUMPY MOOD, IF YOU
COULD IMAGINE, AND I WALKED
THROUGH THE KITCHEN, AND SHE
ASKED ME TO DO SOMETHING FOR
HER, AND I SNAPPED AT HER,
WHICH WAS THE WRONG THING FOR
ME TO DO, BUT I WAS AT -- ON
THE EDGE, AND I JUST SAID
SOMETHING LIKE, "CAN'T YOU SEE
I'M BUSY RIGHT NOW," OR
SOMETHING, AND SHE LOOKED AT ME
AND SAID, "MOM, DON'T USE THAT
TONE OF VOICE WITH ME."
I SAID, "WHAT?"
SHE SAID, "THAT'S NOT REALLY
YOU.
THAT'S YOUR OPPONENT."
OPRAH: THAT'S PRETTY GOOD.
>> I WAS STUNNED.
AT FIRST IT WAS LIKE -- THEN I
THOUGHT, OKAY, THAT'S WHY I
SEND HER TO THAT SCHOOL.
OPRAH: SO AT 6 -- SO AT 6, SHE
IS LEARNING THE NUMBER ONE
PRINCIPLE OF KABBALAH IS THAT
YOU TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR
YOUR OWN ACTIONS.
>> YEAH, YEAH.
OPRAH: THAT'S REALLY, REALLY
GOOD.
LET ME ASK YOU, HOW IS
MARRIAGE?
HOW IS IT?
>> INCREDIBLE.
OPRAH: IT'S INCREDIBLE.
>> THANK GOD, YES.
OPRAH: INCREDIBLE.
>> INCREDIBLE.
OPRAH: DID YOU THINK IT WOULD
BE INCREDIBLE?
>> I HAD A FAIRY BOOK -- FAIRY
STORY BOOK, FAIRY TALE IDEA OF
WHAT MARRIAGE WOULD BE LIKE,
AND IT TURNED OUT TO NOT BE
THAT AT ALL.
IT TURNED OUT TO BE BETTER.
HARDER AND BETTER.
OPRAH: HOW SO?
>> UM, I THINK -- I THINK THAT
I'M LEARNING FOR THE FIRST TIME
IN MY LIFE TO LOVE SOMEONE
UNCONDITIONALLY.
OPRAH: HMM.
>> AND THAT'S A HARD THING TO
DO.
BUT THE BEST.
OPRAH: YEAH, SO IT'S NOT ABOUT
YOU.
IT'S ABOUT HIM.
IT'S ABOUT YOU -- IT'S A
SPIRITUAL PARTNERSHIP.
>> TOTALLY.
IT'S ABOUT BEING -- IT'S ABOUT
FACING IN THE SAME DIRECTION.
OPRAH: YEAH, YEAH, YEAH.
MY FRIEND, GARY ZUKAV SAYS
SPIRITUAL PARTNERSHIP IS A
PARTNERSHIP BETWEEN EQUALS FOR
THE PURPOSE OF SPIRITUAL
GROWTH.
AND IF YOU KNOW THAT, THEN ALL
OF THE STUFF THAT COMES UP IN
THE RELATIONSHIP, YOU KNOW IT'S
ALL ABOUT GROWING YOU AND
GROWING HIM TO THE NEXT PLACE.
SO IT'S BETTER THAN YOU
THOUGHT.
>> YEAH, GREAT.
OPRAH: I CAN'T IMAGINE WHAT
THAT IS THEN.
LAST YEAR GUY RITCHIE DIRECTED
HIS WIFE, MADONNA, IN THE
REMAKE OF THE FILM "SWEPT
AWAY."
AND WHILE PROMOTING THE FILM,
THEY SAT DOWN AND INTERVIEWED
EACH OTHER FOR VH-1.
THIS IS A FIRST.
TAKE A LOOK AT SOME OF THIS.
>> WHY DID YOU HIRE ME TO STAR
IN YOUR FILM AND NOT JULIA
ROBERTS?
>> ACTUALLY, I DID ASK HER.
>> AND?
>> SHE SAID NO.
>> SO I WAS LIKE SECOND ON THE
LIST?
>> NO.
>> OH.
>> HOWEVER, YOU WERE AVAILABLE.
YOU'RE CHEAP.
YOU'RE MY WIFE.
>> YOU COULD SAVE MONEY BECAUSE
WE SHARED A ROOM.
>> YES.
>> THAT MAKES SENSE.
SO WHAT WAS IT LIKE WORKING
WITH ME?
I NEED CAN BERRY JUICE OR I
CAN'T WORK.
>> YOU'RE A TRUE PROFESSIONAL.
>> I'M OVER THIS LOW BUDGET
[BEEP] FILM.
>> I'D WORK WITH YOU IN A
HEARTBEAT AGAIN.
>> WOULD YOU?
DID IT MAKE YOU JEALOUS TO SEE
HIM LAY ON TOP OF ME AND SMOOCH
UP ON MY NECK?
WELL, GUY, YOU WROTE IT.
>> WHY ARE YOU BITING YOUR LIP.
>> I'M JUST LOOKING FORWARD TO
THE ANSWER.
>> WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO HAVE
BEEN JEALOUS?
>> YEAH.
>> AH.
>> JUST A LITTLE BIT.
>> YEAH, A BIT JEALOUS.
DID YOU KISS HIM?
>> I THINK MY LIPS BRUSHED UP
AGAINST HIS A FEW TIMES.
I DIDN'T TRY TO DO IT.
IT JUST HAPPENED.
>> REALLY?
>> UH-HUH.
IN THE TUSSLE.
>> I DIDN'T KNOW THAT.
SO, WHAT, YOU WANT ME TO
HAVE --
>> HAVE A REACTION?
>> HAVE A REACTION?
>> IF YOU LIKE.
>> GET OFF HER.
[APPLAUSE]
OPRAH: COMING UP, BRITNEY
SPEARS ON THE FIRST TIME SHE
MET MADONNA.
WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK.
BACK IN A MOMENT.
>> SHE'S THE SMARTEST PERSON I
KNOW, ACTUALLY.
AND WHEN YOU TALK TO MADONNA,
IT'S WEIRD BECAUSE SHE CAN BE
25 YEARS OLD OR SHE COULD BE
500 YEARS OLD, LIKE SHE'S GOT
THAT KIND OF KNOWLEDGE.
>> SHE'S A GENIUS.
SHE'S ALWAYS CHANGING, AND
EVERYONE'S LOVED HER AT
DIFFERENT PERIODS OF HER LIFE,
WHICH IS REALLY COOL.
>> THE GREAT THING ABOUT
MADONNA IS SHE DOES FASHION ON
HER OWN TERMS, WHICH IS HOW WE
DO IT BEING GAY, ON OUR OWN
TERMS.
LIKE A VIRGIN
OOH
TOUCHED FOR THE VERY FIRST
TIME
>> YOU LOOK UP ICON IN THE
DICTIONARY, THERE'S A PICTURE
OF MADONNA.
>> SHE'S DILIGENT, EXPRESSIVE,
RISK TAKING, AND THAT'S THE
BEAUTY OF BEING AN ARTIST.
SHE DOES NOT HOLD BACK.
>> I'M NOT SINGING.
YOU'RE NOT GETTING ME TODAY.
GET INTO THE GROOVE
OH, YOU GOT TO MOVE PROVE
YOUR LOVE TO ME
>> SHE KEEPS REINVENTING
HERSELF IN SUCH AN AMAZING WAY,
AS A WOMAN AS AN ARTIST AND SHE
ALWAYS SINGS FROM HER HEART AND
FROM HER LIFE EXPERIENCE, AND
TO HAVE THAT KIND OF LONGEVITY
IN ANY BUSINESS, ESPECIALLY
SHOW BUSINESS, IT'S AMAZING.
MY HAT'S OFF TO HER.
[APPLAUSE]
>> THANK YOU.
OPRAH: BACKSTAGE AT THIS YEAR'S
MTV VIDEO MUSIC AWARDS WHERE
MADONNA CAUSED QUITE A STIR.
WHAT YOUNG PERFORMERS DO YOU
LOVE TO WATCH?
>> EMINEM.
OPRAH: EMINEM?
>> YEP, HE'S GREAT.
MISSY.
OPRAH: MISSY.
>> HMM.
I THINK JUSTIN TIMBERLAKE IS AN
AMAZING PERFORMER.
BRITNEY.
OPRAH: BRITNEY.
[LAUGHTER]
YEAH.
>> DUH.
OPRAH: THE DAY BEFORE THEY TOOK
THE MTV STAGE BY STORM, BRITNEY
SPEARS SAT DOWN TO TALK ABOUT
YOU.
>> YOU'VE BEEN SNEAKING AROUND.
OPRAH: JUST A LITTLE BIT.
>> MY FIRST MEMORY OF MADONNA
IS WHEN SHE DID "LIKE A
VIRGIN."
OH, MY GOODNESS, HONESTLY, I
REMEMBER WATCHING HER VIDEOS
AND SAYING, I WANT TO DO THAT
ONE DAY.
FIRST TIME I MET HER IN PERSON,
I WENT TO ONE OF HER SHOWS.
I THINK IT WAS HER DROWNED
WORLD TOUR.
I WAS EXTREMELY NERVOUS.
DOES SHE REALLY KNOW WHO I AM?
LIKE I'M NOT THAT COOL, YOU
KNOW.
JUST FREAKIN' MADONNA, MAN.
BUT SHE WAS VERY SWEET.
VERY, VERY COOL.
SHE WAS BACKSTAGE PLAYING THE
GUITAR AND SHE WAS WITH LOLA.
WE WORKED TOGETHER OFF AND ON.
ONE DAY I CAME TO REHEARSAL AND
I WAS REALLY TIRED.
SHE SAID I FEEL YOUR ENERGY.
SHE SAID TAKE TIME OUT FOR YOU
AND YOUR SOUL.
I THINK FOR A WOMAN SHE HAD A
LOT OF BALLS.
SHE DID WHAT SHE FELT RIGHT.
SHE'S STUNNINGLY BEAUTIFUL
STILL THE WAY SHE TAKES CARE OF
HERSELF AND AWAY FROM WORK, THE
FACT THAT SHE IS ABLE TO RAISE
A GREAT FAMILY, TO REALLY MAKE
A FAMILY AND A BOND LIKE THAT,
I THINK THAT'S SO IMPORTANT.
SHE'S A TRUE ARTIST.
I THINK SHE IS THE POP ICON.
SHE'S LIKE THE PIONEER OF ALL
WOMEN.
VOGUE, VOGUE, VOGUE, VOGUE
OPRAH: THANK YOU.
>> WOW!
I'M SO FLATTERED.
OPRAH: WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK.
WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK.
OPRAH: VIEWERS FROM ALL OVER
THE WORLD EMAILED US WHEN THEY
HEARD THAT MADONNA WAS STOPPING
BY FOR A VISIT, BUT THERE WAS
ONE LETTER WE THOUGHT MADONNA
WOULD LIKE TO HEAR FOR HERSELF.
TAKE A LOOK.
>> DEAR OPRAH, MY BEST FRIEND
SINCE KINDERGARTEN, CARRIE, IS
DIAGNOSED WITH A RARE LIVER
CANCER JUST AFTER HER 17TH
BIRTHDAY.
FOUR PAINFUL MONTHS LATER,
CARRIE PASSED AWAY.
BEFORE SHE DIED, MADONNA PUT A
SMILE BACK ON HER FACE.
SHE'D BEEN A HUGE FAN SINCE SHE
WAS A LITTLE GIRL.
ONE DAY UNEXPECTEDLY CARRIE
RECEIVED A PHONE CALL FROM
MADONNA.
THAT DAY WAS THE FIRST DAY
SINCE SHE HAD BEEN SICK THAT I
HEARD TRUE HAPPINESS IN HER
VOICE.
AND THE PHONE CALLS DIDN'T STOP
THERE.
EVERY DAY AFTER THAT, MADONNA
WOULD CALL CARRIE.
CARRIE AND MADONNA DEVELOPED A
TRUE FRIENDSHIP.
IT TALKED ABOUT EVERYTHING FROM
MUSIC TO THE AFTERLIFE.
MADONNA WAS CARRIE'S ANGEL.
SINCE CARRIE IS NOT WITH US
TODAY, I WANTED MADONNA TO KNOW
HOW MUCH OF A POSITIVE EFFECT
SHE HAD ON CARRIE.
SHE IS THE REASON CARRIE WOKE
UP EVERY MORNING.
SHE'S ALSO THE REASON I'VE BEEN
ABLE TO DEAL WITH LOSING CARRIE
AND FOR THAT MADONNA IS MY
ANGEL, TOO.
SHE SAVED US BOTH.
CRYSTAL.
OPRAH: THAT'S BRINGING THE
LIGHT.
THAT'S SPREADING THE LIGHT,
YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.
[APPLAUSE]
SO THERE ARE THREE PEOPLE HERE
TODAY WHO NEVER DREAMED THEY'D
GET THE CHANCE TO THANK YOU IN
PERSON.
MEET CRYSTAL, CARRIE'S MOM GAIL,
AND CARRIE'S SISTER LISA.
WHAT DID YOU WANT TO SAY?
>> I WANT TO SAY YOU WERE THE
MOST AMAZING PERSON EVER.
OPRAH: MADONNA'S NEW BOOK.
GET IT.
GET IT AND READ IT TO YOUR
CHILDREN.
READ IT TO YOUR CHILDREN, FOR
YOUR CHILDREN WHO CAN'T READ.
IT'S CALLED "THE ENGLISH
ROSES."
IT'S BEAUTIFULLY DONE.
MADONNA AND THE GAP PUT
TOGETHER A LITTLE GIFT BAG FOR
EVERYBODY TO TAKE HOME.
IT'S FILLED WITH THE NEW BOOK,
A PAIR OF THE NEW GAP
CORDUROYS.
WHERE'D YOU GET THEM JEANS --
AS SEEN ON TV, AND THE MADONNA
"AMERICAN LIFE" C.D.
BYE, EVERYBODY.
CAPTIONED BY THE
NATIONAL CAPTIONING INSTITUTE
--WWW.NCICAP.ORG--
>> THE NEW IRAQ.
PRESIDENT BUSH GOING TO THE U.N.
ASKING FOR MORE HELP, BUT
OFFERING NO APOLOGIES FOR THE
U.S. PLAN.
KEY ALLIES SAY THEY WANT MORE.
LOU GEHRIG'S DISEASE.
WHY ARE SO MANY GULF WAR
VETERANS COMING DOWN WITH THIS
DEADLY AND INCURABLE DISEASE?
BROKEN TRUST.
THE LATEST REVELATIONS ABOUT
SEXUALITY MISCONDUCT AND RAPE AT
THE U.S. AIR FORCE ADEMY.
AND LOST AND FOUND.
HOW THE SAME DEVICE THAT HELPS
DRIVERS FIND THEIR WAY IS
TURNING OUT TO BE A CRIME
FIGHTER AS WELL.
[CAPTIONING MADE POSSIBLE BY
U.S. DEPT. OF EDUCATION AND
NATIONAL BROADCASTING COMPANY]
>> GOOD EVENING.
A SHOWDOWN OF SORTS IS TAKING
SHAPE IN NEW YORK TONIGHT, THE
SITE OF THE ANNUAL UNITED
NATIONS GENERAL ASSEMBLY.
PRESIDENT BUSH IS SCHEDULED TO
SPEAK TOMORROW AT A TIME WHEN
THE U.S. IS SOLICITING
INTERNATIONAL HELP FOR THE
INCREASINGLY EXPENSIVE AND
DIFFICULT TASK OF STABILIZING
IRAQ AND TURNING IT OVER TO THE
IRAQIS.
THE PRESIDENT IS EXPECTED TO
TAKE A HARD LINE ON HIS DECISION
TO GO TO WAR AND OTHER
COUNTRIES, LED BY FRANCE, ARE
EXPECTED TO TAKE AN EQUALLY HARD
LINE IN DEMANDING MORE
CONCESSIONS.
ALL OF THIS AS THE GUERRILLA WAR
CONTINUES IN IRAQ, AND ONCE
AGAIN TODAY THE U.N. WAS A
TARGET.
A SUICIDE BOMBER DETONATED A
LARGE EXPLOSIVE IN THE PARKING
LOT OF THE U.N. COMPOUND,
KILLING AN IRAQI POLICEMEN.
WE BEGIN WITH THE PRESIDENT'S
SPEECH AND NBC'S DAVID GREGORY
IN NEW YORK WITH THE
PRESIDENT.
>> THE PRESIDENT WILL ADDRESS
THE U.N. FOR THE FIRST TIME
SINCE THE WAR WHEN HE ACCUSED
THE SECURITY COUNCIL OF FAILING
TO LIVE UP TO ITS
RESPONSIBILITIES IN IRAQ.
WHILE THE ADMINISTRATION NOW
NEEDS HELP FROM THE
INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY, MONEY
AND TROOPS, AIDES SAY MR. BUSH
ISN'T ABOUT TO APOLOGIZE FOR
WAGING A WAR MANY OPPOSED.
THE PRESIDENT SPEAKING TO FOX
NEWS TONIGHT.
>> I WILL MAKE IT CLEAR THAT I
MADE THE RIGHT DECISION AND THE
OTHERS THAT JOINED US MADE THE
RIGHT DECISION.
THE WORLD IS A BETTER PLACE
WITHOUT SADDAM HUSSEIN.
>> DISAGREEMENTS OVER THE WAR
AND THE FUTURE OF IRAQ WILL
DOMINATE MR. BUSH'S SCHEDULE AT
THE U.N., WHICH INCLUDES A
SERIES OF MEETINGS, INCLUDING
ONE-ON-ONES WITH FRANCE'S CHIRAC
AND GERMANY'S SCHROEDER.
CRITICS SAY THE PRESIDENT, WHO
MET NEW GOVERNMENT MINISTERS
FROM IRAQ TODAY, MUST COMMIT TO
LETTING THE U.N. PLAY A LARGER
POLITICAL ROLE IN IRAQ.
IT'S A GOAL THE WHITE HOUSE
SHARES, BUT OFFICIALS SAY A
COMPLETE HANDOVER NOW WOULD BE
PREMATURE.
>> I THINK THAT WE MUST
UNDERSTAND THAT HAVING THE U.N.
BE A PART OF IT IS A WAY TO
SHARE THE BURDEN, SHARE THE
RESPONSIBILITY, AND SHARE THE
COST.
>> WITH THE COST RISING FAST,
THE ADMINISTRATION'S TOP MAN IN
IRAQ WAS ON CAPITOL HILL TODAY
DEFENDING THE WHITE HOUSE'S NEW
REQUEST FOR $87 BILLION, SAYING
TERRORISTS HOPE THE U.S. WILL
CUT AND RUN.
>> IF WE FAIL TO RECREATE IRAQ
WITH A SOVEREIGN DEMOCRACY
SUSTAINED BY A SOLID ECONOMY, WE
WILL HAVE PROVIDED THE
TERRORISTS WITH AN INCREDIBLE
ADVANTAGE IN THEIR WAR AGAINST
US.
>> AS FOR THE U.N., THE
PRESIDENT MAY BE COMING BACK
AFTER THE WAR, BUT IT'S NOT WITH
OPEN ARMS.
OFFICIALS ARE OPTIMISTIC ABOUT A
NEW RESOLUTION, BUT AGAIN SOUND
DISMISSIVE.
SAID ONE TONIGHT, "WE WILL BE
SUCCESSFUL IN IRAQ WITH OR
WITHOUT THE U.N."
DAVID GREGORY, NBC NEWS, NEW
YORK.
>> THIS IS PHASE TWO OF THE HIGH
STAKES POKER GAME THAT BEGAN AT
THE U.N. MORE THAN A YEAR AGO
WITH THE UNITED STATES TRYING TO
SELL THE
OTHER SECURITY COUNCIL MEMBERS
ON THE IDEA THAT THEY HAD NO
CHOICE BUT TO INVADE IRAQ, AND
THE FRENCH, LEADING THE
OPPOSITION, COUNSELING EVERYONE
TO HOLD THEIR CARDS.
WHERE IT GOES FROM HERE.
TONIGHT, HERE'S NBC'S CHIEF
FOREIGN AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT
ANDREA MITCHELL.
>> ONCE AGAIN COLIN POWELL IS
BACK IN NEW YORK,
TRYING TO WIN A U.N. MANDATE FOR
THE PRESIDENT'S IRAQ POLICY.
ONCE AGAIN, HIS CHIEF NEMESIS IS
FRENCH LEADER JACQUES
CHIRAC.
THIS TIME, CHIRAC SAYS HE WON'T
VETO A RESOLUTION AND WANTS TO
HELP THE U.S.
MAYBE SO, BUT THE FRENCH ARE
DEMANDING THAT THE U.S. GIVE
POWER BACK TO IRAQ IN ONE MONTH,
HOLD ELECTIONS A FEW MONTHS
LATER, AND TURN IRAQ'S
RECONSTRUCTION OVER TO THE
U.N.
POWELL CALLS THAT TIMETABLE A
NONSTARTER.
>> WHAT WE DON'T WANT TO DO IS
SET THEM UP FOR FAILURE BY
JUMPSTARTING THE PROCESS OR
TRYING TO DO SOMETHING NOW THAT
IS ABSOLUTELY UNREALISTIC.
>> WHAT DO THE FRENCH REALLY
WANT?
>> I DON'T S A STRONG ECONOMIC
MOTIVE IN WHY CHIRAC IS DOING
THIS.
I THINK IT'S POLITICAL.
I THINK IT'S POLITICAL IN TERMS
OF HIS OWN DOMESTIC
CONSTITUENCY.
I THINK IT'S POLITICAL IN TERMS
OF THE ROLE FRANCE WANTS TO BE
SEEN AS PLAYING IN THE REGION
AND IN THE WORLD.
>> THIS TIME, THE GERMANS ANDT
-- AND THE RUSSIANS SAY THEY ARE
MORE
FLEXIBLE ON POSSIBLE FINANCIAL
AID, BUT WON'T SEND TROOPS.
AND AFTER THAT SUICIDE BOMBING
AT THE U.N. COMPOUND IN BAGHDAD
TODAY, THE U.N. IS RETHINKING
HOW BIG A ROLE IT WANTS IN
IRAQ.
>> WE WILL GO FORWARD, BUT OF
COURSE IF IT CONTINUES TO
DETERIORATE, THEN OUR OPERATIONS
WILL BE HANDICAPPED
CONSIDERABLY.
>> THE U.S. IS HOPING TO GET
A SMALL NUMBER OF MUSLIM TROOPS,
10,000-15,000, FROM TURKEY
BANGLADESH, AND PAKISTAN, AND IT
IS OFFERING INCENTIVES, TODAY AN
$8.5 BILLION LOAN TO TURKEY.
BUT WITHOUT A STRONG NEW U.N.
RESOLUTION, OTHER COUNTRIES ARE
NOT LIKELY TO SEND TROOPS OR
MONEY.
DIPLOMATIC SOURCES SAY POWELL IS
NOW NEGOTIATING A WEAK
RESOLUTION THAT WILL NOT GIVE
OTHER COUNTRIES THE POWER THEY
WANT.
AS A RESULT, THEY WON'T PROVIDE
THE TROOPS OR THE MONEY THE U.S.
NEEDS.
ANDREA MITCHELL, NBC NEWS, NEW
YORK.
>> NBC NEWS WILL COVER THE
PRESIDENT'S SPEECH TO THE UNITED
NATIONS GENERAL ASSEMBLY LIVE
TOMORROW MORNING.
IT'S SCHEDULED TO START AROUND
10:30 EASTERN TIME ON THIS NBC
STATION.
NOW TO THE MYSTERIOUS CASE OF
THE MUSLIM ARMY CHAPLAIN WHO WAS
WORKING WITH DETAINEES AT
GUANTANAMO BAY.
CAPTAIN JAMES YEE, A GRADUATE OF
WEST POINT, AND A MAN THE ARMY
HELD OUT AS AN EXAMPLE OF
MUSLIMS IN THE MILITARY, NOW IS
UNDER INVESTIGATION FOR
ESPIONAGExD AIDING THE ENEMY, AND
SPYING.
HERE IS NBC'S JIM MIKLASZEWSKI.
>> AS A MUSLIM CHAPLAIN FOR THE
U.S. ARMY, CAPTAIN JAMES YEE WAS
ASSIGNED TO COUNSEL AL QAEDA AND
TALIBAN PRISONERS AT GUANTANAMO
BAY, CUBA.
>> SO EVEN WITH THE DETAINEES,
MY JOB IS TO HELP INSURE THAT
ONE HAS THE ABILITY TO PRACTICE
ONE'S REGION.
-- ONE'S RELIGION.
>> BUT NOW IT'S YEE BEHIND BARS,
SUSPECTED OF PASSING MILITARY
SECRETS TO AL QAEDA
TERRORISTS.
PENTAGON OFFICIALS TELL NBC NEWS
WHEN YEE WAS ARRESTED SEPTEMBER
10, HE HAD CLASSIFIED DOCUMENTS
LISTING THE NAMES OF PRISONERS
AT GUANTANAMO BAY AND MANY OF
THE U.S. MILITARY GUARDS, PLUS
DRAWINGS OF THE PRISONER
FACILITIES.
SOURCES ALSO REPORT YEE HAD BEEN
OBSERVED IN THE U.S. WITH
SEVERAL MUSLIM GROUPS UNDER
SURVEILLANCE FOR POSSIBLE TIES
TO TERRORISM.
A GRADUATE OF WEST POINT, YEE
CONVERTED TO ISLAM IN SAUDI
ARABIA FOLLOWING THE FIRST GULF
WAR.
HE QUIT THE MILITARY BRIEFLY AND
WAS RECRUITED BACK INTO THE ARMY
AS A MUSLIM CHAPLAIN.
BUT THAT RECRUITING PROCESS MAY
BE THE PROBLEM.
CRITICS CLAIM THE PENTAGON IS
DRAWING ITS MUSLIM CHAPLAINS
FROM GROUPS WHICH HAS SUSPECTED
TIES TO TERRORISM.
LAST YEAR, FEDERAL AGENTS RAIDED
SEVERAL MUSLIM ORGANIZATIONS IN
THE U.S. SUSPECTED OF PASSING
MILLIONS OF DOLLARS TO
TERRORISTS.
SOME OF THE SAME GROUPS THAT
ALSO RECOMMEND MUSLIM CHAPLAINS
FOR THE U.S. MILITARY
>> THESE GROUPS PROFESS A
MILITANT, ANTI-AMERICAN,
PROTERRORIST BRAND OF ISLAM, WAY
OUT OF THE MAINSTREAM OF ISLAM,
THAT IS OPPOSITE OF WHAT THE
MILITARY STANDS FOR.
>> AS OF NOW, NO CHARGES HAVE
BEEN FILED AGAINST JAMES YEE AND
THE MILITARY INVESTIGATION
CONTINUES.
JIM MIKLASZEWSKI, NBC NEWS, THE
PENTAGON.
>> BACK NOW TO IRAQ AND THE
DIFFICULT JOB OF KEEPING THE
PEACE.
IN BAGHDAD, THERE'S BEEN A NEW
WAVE OF CRIME SINCE THE FALL OF
SADDAM AND AT THE SAME TIME, THE
NUMBER OF POLICE, 60,000 BEFORE
THE WAR, HAS DWINDLED TO A
QUARTER OF THAT.
NBC'S RICHARD ENGEL SPENT A
SINGLE SHIFT AT A PRECINCT IN
THE CAPITAL CITY.
>> IT'S JUST AFTER 8:00 A.M.,
AND ANOTHER BUSY DAY IS ALREADY
UNDERWAY AT AL DOURA POLICE
STATION.
SO BUSY THE STATION'S CHIEF,
LIEUTENANT COLONEL ALA HASSAN,
TAKES A STOLEN CAR REPORT
HIMSELF.
"WAS IT LOCKED?" ASKS
HASSAN.
IT WASN'T.
HASSAN, A 20-YEAR VETERAN, SAYS
CRIME IS UP 300% IN HIS MIDDLE
CLASS PRECINCT SINCE SADDAM WAS
TOPPLED.
AND TO FIGHT THIS CRIME WAVE,
HASSAN'S POLICE STATION HAS ONLY
ONE WORKING PHONE, NO RADIO
COMMUNICATIONS, TWO POLICE CARS,
AND A PICKUP TRUCK.
AT 8:15, HASSAN AND HIS MEN
CARRY OUT AN ARREST WARRANT FOR
THE SUSPECTED CARJACKER.
THEY ARRIVE AT THE SUSPECT'S
HOUSE.
8:36,
HIS MOTHER ANSWERS, SAYS HE'S
NOT HOME.
SO THE SEARCH BEGINS.
THE POLICE FIND NO ONE AND
RETURN EMPTY-HANDED.
BUT MOMENTS LATER, THE SUSPECT,
JUST A BOY, TURNS HIMSELF
IN.
HE'D WATCHED THE RAID FROM A
NEIGHBOR'S YARD.
10:20.
TWO BLOODIED TEENAGERS ARE
BROUGHT IN.
THE ONE IN WHITE STABBED THE
SHORTER AFTER HE ATTACKED HIM,
HASSAN COMPLAINS THERE'S NO
PLASTIC BAG FOR THE EVIDENCE, SO
HE WRAPS IT IN PAPER.
10:A 55.
-- 10:55.
THIS GRANDMOTHER SAYS A MAN
OFFERED HER A LIFT AND PROCEEDED
TO STEAL $500 FROM HER, THE
EQUIVALENT OF ALMOST HALF A
YEAR'S WAGES FOR MOST
IRAQIS.
IN HIS NO-NONSENSE STYLE, HASSAN
SAYS, "IT'S YOUR FAULT.
YOU SHOULDN'T GET INTO A CAR
WITH STRANGERS."
THIS POLICE STATION IS
TYPICAL.
THE OFFICERS COMPLAIN THEY ARE
UNDERPAID AND ILL-EQUIPPED AT
THE TIME BAGHDAD NEEDS THEM
MOST.
NOW, HASSAN'S 100 OFFICERS, WHO
MAKE JUST $120 A MONTH, ARE
RESPONSIBLE FOR A PRECINCT OF
380,000 PEOPLE, INCLUDING SOME
EX-CONS.
SADDAM RELEASED A LOT OF
CRIMINALS BEFORE THE WAR, HE
SAYS, AND NOW
MANY PEOPLE DON'T HAVE JOBS AND
HAVE NOTHING TO DO.
12:15.
THE SHIFT IS WIPEDING DOWN.
BUT THE GRIMMEST CASE IS YET TO
COME.
HASSAN DISPATCHES HIS MEN TO
COLLECT A DEAD BODY HIDDEN IN
THE REEDS, DECOMPOSED.
THE OFFICERS THINK IT'S A
REVENGE KILLING.
IT'S BEEN A BUSY SHIFT, DEALING
WITH DOZENS OF CRIMES -- THEFT,
THE HUNT FOR A CARJACKER,
ASSAULT, MURDER.
BUT COLONEL HASSAN ISN'T
DISCOURAGED.
HIS PRECINCT A WINDOW INTO WHAT
BAGHDAD HAS BECOME, AND
ORDINARY PEOPLE DETERMINED TO
MAKE IT BETTER.
RICHARD ENGEL, NBC NEWS,
BAGHDAD.
>> ALSO IN THE MIDDLE EAST, A
DEFIANT YASSER ARAFAT IS TELLING
TELLING NBC NEWS HE WILL RESIST
IN ISRAEL TRIES TO FOLLOW
THROUGH ON ITS THREAT TO EXPEL
HIM FROM THE WEST BANK AND
GAZA.
NBC'S CAMPBELL BROWN ASKED
ARAFAT IF HE WOULD FIGHT
BACK.
>> IF YOU WERE IN MY PLACE, WHAT
WOULD YOU DO?
YOU THINK YOU WILL ACCEPT?
>> ARE YOU PREPARED TO DIE HERE
IF THE ISRAELIS TRY TO EXPEL
YOU?
>> FOR THE PEACE, IN THE LAND OF
PEACE, IT IS VERY IMPORTANT TO
GIVE EVERYTHING, EVEN YOUR
LIFE.
>> WHEN ASKED WHETHER HE HAD
MADE ANY MISTAKES AS A LEADER,
ARAFAT SAID, "MAYBE.
I AM A HUMAN